DAW - Apple M3 - Not So Fast

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[NeuroPete]

Hey Barry. Thanks for the vid. I appreciate your stuff. As others have pointed out, you got it backwards. It is the EFFICIENCY cores that most DAWS do not use. Most only use the PERFORMANCE cores, including my favourite, Studio One. So the take-away from James Zhan's video that you reference is that in purchasing a new Apple Silicon Mac, one should consider the number of each core type and how much money can be spent.
I have an M1 Max laptop with 64 GB RAM, 8 performance cores and 2 efficiency cores. It is working well for everything music-wise I do, and I don't expect to need to upgrade for the next 3 to 5 years. However, if someone is new to Apple Silicon and wants to get the best performance in a DAW, the M3 Max can have up to 12 performance cores (with 4 efficiency cores), with a single core performance somewhere around 25 or 30% higher than M1 Max, and an upper RAM limit of 128 GB (vs. 64 GB for M1 Max). Of course, the M3 Ultra (when it comes) would be even better. Expensive, of course!
So the best option for you may be an M1 Max. The tricky bit is figuring out what you expect to need over the next few years, with the minimum cost. If you expect you may work with many instances of massive sample libraries, then RAM should be the priority. If you plan to work more with CPU intensive synthesizer or effects plugins, then you might want to prioritize performance.
For me, the most important factor is latency reduction. When I record my voice or play keyboard over other tracks I want to reduce the buffer size enough that I don't hear a delay or echo. But lower buffer size means more CPU load for all tracks. If the CPU can't keep up, then you get pops and clicks (which I used to get all the time on my PC, which is one reason I upgraded to Apple Silicon). There are various ways to reduce CPU load, such as reducing polyphony, freezing tracks, and disabling plugins (some DAWs have automatic features), but one easier mitigation is to get the fastest CPU you can afford. With my M1 Max, the only times I've heard pops and clicks is when my buffer sample size was 64 and I was playing multiple notes live on a complex virtual instrument (Native Instruments Arkhis, for example) with the sustain pedal down.
But in any case, I am grateful for Mr. Zhan's video, and for yours, Barry. When it does come time for me to upgrade, I will consider buying a previous year's model.
Again, thanks. Peter.

[miketesoriero]

The latest pro tools update now makes use of the efficiency cores. It would be great to see an updated comparison to see how much it improves things.

[hipnoise_studio]

For my understanding, Pro Tools 2024.3 took care of that and today it also utilizes all the cores in your apple silicon

[pawnotdaw]

That guy's video helped me choose a M2 macbook air instead of M3. It works great for me on Ableton and Logic

[reedereed]

I still use the trashcan Mac Pro with Digital Performer and have never had an issue, even using virtual instruments. I too use a Mac until it shows its age with the software that I am using. I really don’t chase what’s new all the time…I tend to focus more on making music instead.

[rahulroaringrc]

How to check that DAW is using which kind of core of CPU 🤔

[xplanet]

Saw that video, he does some great content, it basically informed my purchase of a M1 Studio, they were going cheap, 25% off, thought it was a good buy for what I wanted it for.

[yetkangwong]

Berry thank you for this video, been waiting on more audio production creators like yourself to cover this topic and bring awareness into this matter

[JamesZhan]

A bit late to the party but—thanks for the shoutout, Barry! You've got some great videos on this channel 😃

[chrisishoy]

I watched James’ video soon after it was released, and it was an eye opener! I was using the Mac Pro trash can with spinner hard drives at the time. Using virtual instruments with Pro Tools HDX was becoming difficult and cumbersome. I now have the Mac Studio M2 Max with 64GB of RAM with a couple external SSD’s, and the latest Pro Tools is working great! At some point with technology if you want to evolve with features and performance, you have to bite the bullet and upgrade. This is my 3rd Mac for studio use since 2010, and I can only hope that this M2 Max will be good for at least another 5-10 years. I think 10 years would be expecting too much though.

[TheGuitarNerdShow]

Hey Barry - I'm glad you did this video. I'm going to be in the Market for a new Mac Studio very soon and have also been looking at the M3 (particularly the M3 Max). I saw the video you're speaking of in your video as well. Afterwards I took a look inside Logic on my machine (M1 Max Mac Studio) and Logic IS using the Efficiency cores as welll as the Performance cores and has done so as long as I've been running this machine (June of 2022). It spikes the Efficiency cores up high whereas the Performance cores are more evenly distributed (with the exception of that last core, which always seems to spike up high, especially when running Virtual Instruments). Anyhow, that's just my little observation.

Again, I'm glad you made this Video Barry - as our computers are super important to the work we do, it's good to cover those as well.

[johnvender]

I'm still using M1 but I have been considering upgrading. I use Logic and given this I am in no rush to get M3. When Apple update Logic to use all the cores in M3 I might consider it again. I have only maxed out the M1 couple of times so there is no hurry. Interesting that Reaper and Cubase are ahead of everybody else when it comes to this

[jazzdude]

great Video.... PC User here! and i always know each and every core/thread distribution since many many years when i use Cubase.
Its a desktop utility for CPU/Threads+ RAM a GPU Perromance and i also can see how many processes run (in the background). My processes are abt 70 in WIN 10 when starting Cubase. DPC Latency is is max abt 100usec. (use DPC Latency Mon by Resplendence).
ALL MUSIC MACHINE WINdows i use are stripped to their bare functions ( no MS Bloat, AV and other BS like W LAN or Bluetooth).

[HazyJ]

I've come to really enjoy and respect your content. I enjoy the discussions you have and the questions you pose. What I love the most is you don't act like a typical influencer. Like I feel like you're really just here to have a parasocial conversation.

[rano]

Reaper is seriously impressive. They were one of the first DAWs, if not first to support apple silicon. There are only 2 developers working on Reaper and I remember from an interview, one of the main dev/creator of Reaper Justin was talking about how there were no official documentation from apple about utilizing all of the performance and efficiency cores properly of the different apple silicon's at that time(that was over 2 years ago), so IG he really figured it out all by himself or there might be documentations now because Reaper has been running and fully utilizing apple chips from the beginning. It's absolutely crazy Reaper is developed by like 2 people yet it's beating every DAW in performance and efficiency and even beating apple software on apple hardware. Remarkable. Such a great piece of software with no DRM and extremely lightweight and efficient code.

[coldskoolbeatz]

Reaper's efficiency is astonishing!! I started using Acustica Audio plugins which are the MOST cpu intensive plugins I've ever seen. But they sound so good. I was using ProTools and Cubase to mix and the Performance meter fluctuates from 70 - 80% following my usual process.

Using Reaper, I can't even get it to 50%. No exageration. I've totally switched to Reaper for mixing. My CPU thanks me everytime I launch it.

[rburton]

The m1 MacBook Pro was the best computer apple made for DAW.

[JBHinCJBH]

I recently got a 14” MBP M3 Pro, 18gb ram, I just tried 80 tracks in Ableton 12 using Arturia ARP 2600, Eventide Blackhole, SSL native channel strip, SSL native bus comp, Ableton comp & Ableton 8 band eq, cpu use is at 51%, it is only using the 4 performance cores and 2 of the efficiency cores lightly, it’s not ideal, but 80 tracks is a bonkers amount, I very rarely go over 40 tracks and even then they are not all playing at the same time, the MBP is plenty good enough for me personally, but it would be nice if software developers would play catch up.

[dstarling]

This is currently a non-issue. Apple released an update that addressed this not long after this video was posted. The efficiency cores are available to Logic. Although, I’m not entirely sure that the efficiency cores are really suited for realtime audio, so this non-issue was probably a non-issue to begin with. The efficiency cores are generally used by the OS and for processes that don’t require a lot horsepower, freeing the performance cores to do the heavy lifting.

[thomaspipermusic]

I'm not entirely sure if this is completely accurate. Apple has altered the way they configure their chips. Previously, the M1 and M2 Pro and Max had identical CPUs. However, this is no longer the case; the M3 Max now comes in two versions, and the higher-end version boasts more performance cores, making it faster than any previous Mac. The most significant difference is with the M3 Pro, as some versions of this chip have fewer performance cores than the earlier M2 and M1 models. Based on my observation, it appears that software like Ableton and Logic only utilize performance cores if the buffer setting is under 256. If it's set to 512 or above, all cores are used, likely because latency is less of an issue at that point. I'm not entirely certain about this, but it seems to be the case with my Macs. I own an M1 Max MacBook Pro, an M2 Air, and I've just ordered a Mac Studio M2 Ultra to replace my 2019 Mac Pro. (what a waste that was)