The Myth of Waterproof Breathable Video

Description

[danmckay]

I meet a lot of people with a lot of slick gear here in the Seattle area (surprise). I have a close relative who's an avid ice and rock climber, winter camper, tele-skiier, who's climbed Denali, Katahdin's knife edge, knows how to handle herself on glaciers, has real experiene with avalanche s&r, decades more time out in the woods than anyone I've known, and has no affiliations to color her opinion on equipment. Over the years, she's taken me out on treks, had me learn some basic principles of not dying in the woods, and introduced me to some of her climbing buddies. I form my opinions first from experience where possible, but when I've got new conditions to cover, these are the kinds of opinions I trust. I don't pretend to have the world of experience myself, but an awful lot of these people strongly prefer Wiggy's bags. Take that as you will.

[jbradshaw]

I stumbled on this video whilst watching a bushcraft vid. I have been climbing and mountaineering for 27 years and enjoy hiking/trekking in the northern hemisphere mainly in the UK where I reside and in Scandinavian countries,

When you use the term film, do you mean the membrane? If so to suggest people are wasting money I think is somewhat confusing?

I agree that the term breathable is somewhat misleading and most people do not understand the dynamics of moisture vapour transfer.

Your argument I believe is flawed. The steam demonstration is simply a method of explanation of the process. Of course no person will make steam/vapour process like that. However in addition to quantative data perhaps what is more important is qualatitive data. In other words try walking up hill for an hr in a non permable in liner vs a mordern gortex etx. The results will be clear from all you speak too.

Membranes were actually developed for high altitude and cold weather work. In humid muggy conditions membrane jackets perform badley because an equlebium of temp between the inside and outside of the jacket occurs and limits he moisture vapour process as the pressure outside is greater or the same or near.

In cold weather the jackets perfom much better.

I actually prefer a ventile, fjallraven g1000 material or paramo product which breath way better. That said come to the Caingorms in Scotland in Feb in the pourimg rain without a hard shell and the results can be lethal.

Hope you dont mind me sharing my spin on things, I enjoyed your vid.

Kind Regards.

[harrywiner]

I have been using a wiggys snow coverall since the 80's for snowblowing and shovelling. It's still like new, fantastic in the northeast cold. Thank you wiggys.

[StagnantExistance]

I was hiking in the mountains in July and it started to rain. I put on my gore-tex rain suit. While I was walking in a relatively flat terrain, it was not so bad. I opened the ventilation ports on the side the jacket and trousers and carried on. Then followed a very steep part of the trail. At the top I removed all of my rain gear, because it was too damn hot. I was wet because of my own sweat. The outside temperature was around +15. It took me a while to cool down. I continued with my regular clothes.

[mountainmatters]

Thanks for the video Jerry.  Thanks for helping educate those that are willing to listen and learn 

[nathansharp]

I was a snowmaker in Colorado and made the mistake of getting the Irish Setter Gore-tex boots made by Red Wing hoping they’d be the best boots ever. They weren’t.

Just as described in this video my feet would perspirate, the moisture would condense when it hit the freezing shell of the boots and my socks would get soaked within an hour.

The only good things I can say about those boots is that they looked nice (for only a couple winters), and the soles had excellent traction (but wore very quickly).

[DaveStar]

So how to do I stay dry from a down poor while on the move, if I have a fishnet base layer on & lamalite mid layers. what hard shell should I have? Not coated and non membrane?

[jjjsmith]

My first thought when he said thinsulate was: Bought these type for construction and always thought it was me…. Feet NEVER felt warm

[mlongmire]

Ok here is how it really works. Modern Gore Tex laminates are best for sedentary activities like fishing because it can not allow water vaper to escape fast enough to keep up with your bodies perspiration during more strenuous activities. So no the rain didn't go through your Gore Tex, you're soaking wet because your sweating faster than the fabric can shed the moisture. This is true for all modern "breathable" laminates. Now if you are out of shape and get sweaty walking to the mailbox or just a profuse sweater then it's only going to make things worse.

On a side note nothing on planet earth is completely waterproof. It depends on pressure. You tube has plenty of videos showing steel plates being cut in half with water.

Cotton based fabrics like Ventile/etaProof are more breathable than any modern laminates. The confusion is that unless your etaProof/Ventile is of the 300 gram type then it isn't the same thing that was used for RAF immersion suits, fire hoses, etc. The Ventile fabrics I see are mostly 170 gram or lower, and without a synthetic liner the water eventually gets through.