Harvey MG-36 Compass Miter Gauge Accuracy Test

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[zamorafotography]

I appreciate all your videos and the time you put into sharing your knowledge. I believe it was very difficult for Marc to say what he did. He said he felt bad. Please know it was not an attack on you or Harvey it was a review on the copy he received, and he said as much several times.
I felt a bit of anxiety from you during the video. Again it’s not a reflection on you. I have made many purchases from your recommendations and I would never hold you responsible for a bad experience.

Keep up the great work!

[bigdukeelement]

Marc’s review was perfectly timed. I’m in the market. After watching both videos, I’m going nowhere near Harvey. The older I get the more I appreciate customer service. What a shame.

[ChristianN-]

The big, glaring problem here isn't that Marc got a bad sample but that Harvey didn't help him make it right when he reached out. Aftersales is a huge part of high end tools and Harvey dropped the ball on this one. It's the single most important aspect not touched upon in this video.

[gjforeman]

There was a plaque on the wall in our customer service area that stuck with me. It said that a happy customer will tell a few friends, but an upset customer will tell the whole world. Harvey might want to take note of this.

[jamesfranzen]

There certainly is a problem with customer service at Harvey. After watching Marc's review, I decided to cancel my miter fence 
order with Harvey. The miter fence is currently backordered to late February. I called and spoke to their customer service. When asked why I wanted to cancel I told them about the review. Then they wanted me to pay 10% to cancel the order. What? This was not a restocking charge, this was one stroke of a keypad.

I told them that I would never buy another Harvey or Bridge City tool. She said she was sorry to hear that and we ended the conversation.

In the end, they did give me a full refund, but it still left me very annoyed.

[nunyabizness]

Thanks for putiing this out. I, also, have 2 of these miter gauges and have never had an issue hitting the correct angles with the detents. One of them I bought on its own, the other came with the Harvey Alpha tablesaw I had purchased later.

That said, I too, have had issues with Harvey's customer service. So much so that about 3 weeks after getting their saw, and numerous attempts to get answers from customer service, I enquired about returning the saw (I didn't want to have this much money sunk in a tool that had no customer support) and got completely ghosted. To this day I cannot get any response from their customer service dept. I looked at legal remedies but realized the amount of time it would take to pursue those remedies would cost me more than the saw itself, so I dropped it. The issues I had with the saw were not dealbreakers themselves, but the lack of any real customer service is.

[sneezingfrog]

The gap on mine as shipped was 1/16th, the same as Marc's. Frankly, after his experience with CS, figured they just didn't care. This did prompt me to investigate further, and the 3 x 2.5mm hex bolts that hold the block in place do indeed have quite a bit of possible play, and I was able to move the block to their stated <= 1mm spec. I should note that I own both their G700 collection and 615P bandsaw as well, and both of those tools are something that I'd recommend to anyone.

It seems to me that their QA on this particular product is in need of improvement. The gauge in general is, I think, overall a good design, and for me the micro-adjust on the stop is something that you can't get elsewhere. This particular problem would be easily solved pre-ship with a go/no go gauge.

I should note, I suppose, for those considering this gauge, that while the stop is micro-adjust (and, let me assure you, it's great; absolutely killer feature in my opinion), as opposed to much of the competition, there's no vernier scale on the protractor. Now, I'm a simple man -- I use 90 and 45; it's just not often I stray from those two, and while I've got gauges with verniers on them, to be honest I've never needed them; other than the 22.5 stop, a degree of precision is all I need. But if that's your thing, just be aware it hasn't got one.

[davidhansz]

I feel Marc, the Wood Whisperer, bent over backwards explaining how he arrived at his conclusions and really struggled with giving a poor grade to the Harvey Miter Gauge. If in fact he did get a bad gauge and others in the comment section did too, the review is correct. Both of these reviews are representing the customers' experience and both are valid...

[ck]

There are two YouTubers I watch routinely because of the presentation and what I preceive to be genuine integrity in their comments. You and Marc. No need to apologize for differing, or even conflicting, opinions. Both of you guys do great work and provide an enormous amount of information which is much appreciated. Keep it up

[daneyuleb]

I think this was a great, even handed response. My only concern is that sponsored channels (likely) get the cream of the crop in terms of the tools they are sent. I very much imagine that Harvey does extra quality control before sending any product to this channel, so reviews are less likely to be for the average "off the shelf" tool. And... customer support is going to be above average as well if its revealed that the requesting customer is a well known, influential reviewer.

In this case, I get the feeling Harvey didn't really know who Marc was and he got the standard treatment we all might expect---whereas they know who they sponsor and likely provided a bit more quality control when sending (and supporting) the tool to this channel. That always makes it hard to 100% translate the reviewer's experience to what I might expect.

I'd much prefer that, sure, sponsored channels get paid for "free" tools, but not "given" free tools. As a stated policy they should instead use that payment to order the tool anonymously and request support the same way. Otherwise, there's always that suspicion that, while nothing is being done dishonestly, the sponsored content creator is getting VIP treatment whether they requested it or not.

[prostwest]

Great video. I take issue with one assertion: "It's possible...that somehow slipped past quality control...that happens even with high end tools." If I buy anything high end, my primary justification of the expense is perception of the producer's quality control. The promise that they have exerted extraordinary effort to ensure that every unit meets the advertised spec gives me confidence that I won't have to verify, I won't have to tune or tinker, and I certainly won't have to spend my time on a merry-go-round with customer service ( excellent or otherwise ). Eliminating these possibilities is exactly why I shell out more for a premium item; whether a dinner or a tool.

[theoakenknight]

Well, I found the review of which you speak. Back to what I wrote earlier, this is a customer service issue which was an epic fail. I just went through the exercise of selecting my “forever saw” and came very close to buying a Harvey. But in the end I went with you-know-who because I truly value all my fingers, but also because it is a more mature company with superior customer support and support procedures. I think that is what we are seeing here.

[wb_finewoodworking]

@Stumpy Nubs - Not to add fuel to the fire the inaccuracy of the indents was not the only thing Marc didn’t like about the gauge. He made several points on features he didn’t feel were as good as they should be on such a “premium” tool. Those were not addressed in your video. Oh, maybe that comes under opinion. In my opinion they don’t. Those issues were very obvious. The most disturbing point of Marc’s review is that Harvey made no attempt to remedy the situation. As someone who can’t afford to eat the cost of such problems in a tool like perhaps Marc can that’s totally unacceptable to me. There’s no excuse for that happening. Citing the pandemic doesn’t cut it. Harvey totally fell down on their obligations to their customer.

[nitePhyyre]

"The company says they rarely gets returns"

I guess that's what happens when someone with an obviously defective unit contacts customer service and gets told that there's no problem, they don't know how to tighten screws properly, and they're not doing a return. 🤣

[jollyandwaylo]

I am most disappointed with Harvey's response to Marc, not that one or two miter gauges got past quality control. I used to make musical instrument kits and one day a very frustrated customer called up and immediately starting complaining and accusing me of selling a bad product. I had to actually interrupt him to say, 'You are going to be happy at the end of this call.' He calmed down and told me what had happened. I gave him a solution that I would use but told him he could just send it back and I would just send him one already assembled if he wanted. I also said that if he used my solution but didn't like the appearance in a year or two, to just send it to me and I would send him a replacement. He was very happy and I never heard from him so he must have been happy with my solution. I would have thought Harvey would be very concerned and asked the experience level of the customer. Realizing that he was experienced, I would have thought Harvey would want to find out what was wrong so they could correct the issue if it really had gotten past quality control. Solving the problem for one customer could end up solving lots of problems down the road. Very short sighted of Harvey.

[ay]

I want to start by saying that I have always enjoyed your videos and have found your clear, direct, and thorough approach extremely refreshing. I have learned much from you, particularly about shop safety, and have considered you to be a trustworthy source. But (you knew there was a "but" coming, didn't you), whenever a video aggressively promotes a particular brand or product, I become suspicious. I am intimately familiar with how internet marketing works, and I fully understand that you need to be compensated for your efforts. I have no objection to advertising, sponsorships, or affiliate links, provided that any such content is clearly disclosed and identified, something you typically do very well. There can be a fine line between offering an honest opinion and becoming a commercial shill. I am not going to name names, but we all know that there are those in this space (even some highly respected sources) who clearly and routinely cross that line. I honestly do not know if this video crossed that line, that will need to be judged over time in the context of your greater body of work, but I do know that it, as a minimum, brushed right up against it. I hope you accept this comment as it was intended, as a respectful opinion of my own.

p.s.; One additional thought ... had Harvey done the right thing and addressed Marc's problem with what is purported to be an anomalous "bad" example of their product, then there would have been no need for you to make this video. The fact that they did not address what was clearly an inferior example of their product and they left you in a position where you needed to defend them creates the fundamental question that caused me (and many others here) to make my own observation about this video. Of course, I will leave it to you to judge your own relationship with your sponsor.

[ianadams]

Too defensive for my liking. You may have accurately diagnosed what caused the problem on the other review, but the company didn't stand by the product in a manor that would put my money on the table. Your review doesn't resolve the customer service that Mark received.

[jasonking]

You did a great job, and Marc did a great job. I really hope Harvey and my two favorite woodworking YTers can collaborate and get to the bottom of this. Honestly the WORST part of Marc's video was the bit about dealing with Harvey's helpdesk. Sadly, these days, we're all too familiar with "script based" customer support, but the fact that they didn't work through the problem to the point of an actually satisfactory solution for the customer gives me great pause. I hope, more than anything else, Harvey take THAT feedback to heart. No one expects perfection, but everyone expects quality support.

[howler]

I enjoy and sub to both of these channels. I was also surprised by Marc's experience with the tool and with Harvey's service after he brought up his issue with them. You don't just buy the product, you buy the customer service. I know COVID is a factor, but you can't let it be an excuse.

[jmartinez]

My problem with YouTube reviews are sponsored reviews. I can’t believe someone would say anything bad about something paying their bills or was given to them. I would believe someone that bought their tools with their money versus being given tools. But this is just my opinion like you have yours.