Dating Daniel: Prophecy or History?

The Book of Daniel has traditionally been considered an amazing prophecy, as it was supposedly written around the 6th century BCE, but predicted events that would come to pass centuries later. In this video, we examine the dating of the writing of the Book of Daniel - exactly how old is 'old', and was it written before the events it predicts, or after they had already taken place?

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Music: Brak Bnei Original Composition

[debbieshrubb]

Not just a great teaching session about Daniel but also the dating of texts. Thankyou.

[uvas]

Great vid Dr. Josh. I am just finishing up a book that Dr Carrier suggested to me about how the earlier books of the bible were composed. This video picks up right where the book left off. This is a fascinating part of history that so many know so little about, yet has influenced us greatly. Keep up the great work, and I am looking forward to your next vid. :-)

[jtveg]

Thanks for sharing this little bit of history and perspective on the Book Of Daniel.
I appreciate the work you must've put into it.

[Paulogia]

Love this! I'm sure I will have many opportunities to recommend it.

[lesterdilworth]

Great material Dr. Bowen. Loved the 8:48 'text message; 😂

[ironcharioteer]

great video Josh. love the graphics, you guys are getting good at this.

[misskiya]

You separated the Medo-Persian Empire meanwhile the book of Daniel has them together as a combined empire (Darius the Mede and Cyrus the Persian) Daniel depicts them as the Bear which lifted up itself on one side with 3 ribs in his mouth and as the chest and arms of silver. His depictions go in the order of Babylon, Medo-Persia, Greece and then Rome. The bear lifting up itself on one side simply means one of them was more prominent than the other. The two arms and chest of silver represent the 2 kingdoms of Medes and Persians connected together into one empire. The leopard with four heads represents the four of Alexander’s generals that took control after his death. After Alexander's death his Empire was divided among his four generals (known in Latin as the Diadochi, the name by which they are still referenced, from the Greek, Diadokhoi, meaning "successors") the wings represents speed in which the empire conquered. Greece conquered much faster than did Babylon with just 2 wings.

[Larry]

Super video. Clear and concise. Thank you very much. As a newbie to Daniel this was very helpful.

[txfreethinker]

Excellent video! I'd love to see you do a video specifically about Daniel 9. I think that would be interesting.

[lostfan]

How is the Four-Headed leopard a metaphor for Persia? Shouldn't the Greeks be the four headed animal, considering that Alexander's realm was split into four?

[JustScriptureMinistries]

I'm thankful that I am doing a series exactly on this topic currently.

So I will be straight forward on this, this video is filled will inaccurate explanations and summary conclusions of 'what consensus scholarship' agrees on.

The most honest thing said here was 'without going into great detail.' That basically means, 'let me give you my desired outcome' without exactly demonstrating if my conclusions are correct. This would be like going up to a science fair display board seeing the Hypothesis and Results without seeing the procedure and research being done.



At 3:48, the author said that Daniel 9 lays out the time period to Greece. Um no. It's clearly a 490 year period that starts with the rebuilding of the wall 457 BC to 27 AD that says after this the Messiah will be cut off (die by execution, gee I wonder who this could be) and also the 2nd Temple would be destroyed after that as well (ie 70 AD Roman destruction under Titus.)


Is Nebuchadnezzar called Belshazzar's father and vice verse the son? Yes. Which is TOTALLY OKAY because Hebrew and Aramaic don't have a separate word for grandfather and grandson. They use the same word. This is used in the Bible and Assyrian records elsewhere:

Old Testament Ex:
Elisha called Elijah his father (2 Kings 2:12)
1 Kings 19:16 And Jehu the son of Nimshi shalt thou anoint to be 
king over Israel: and Elisha the son of Shaphat of Abelmeholah shalt 
thou anoint to be prophet in thy room.

New Testament Ex:
Jesus “the son of David” Matthew 1:1
Jews “Abraham is our father” John 8:39 

Archaeological Ex:
Black Obelisk of Shalmaneser III 
Calls Israel’s King Jehu as ‘son of Omri’

The author said at the ~6:00 that 'we don't need a simplistic supernatural view.' What that really meant was that critics can't allow for early authorship because the God of the Bible and Israel would then be real because the only explanation for Daniel to forecast the next 700 years was by supernatural means.

[HConstantine]

Dating Daniel? I think I'd rather go on a date with Nebuchadnezzar.

[ChipAltmanxD]

This is a very helpful video. Thanks for making it.

[thealsoperson]

Also worth noting verses like 12:9 where Daniel is told to keep his prophecies secret. "The words are to remain secret and sealed until the time of the end." This would explain to 2nd-century readers why they had never heard of these prophecies before. They were supposedly kept secret until they were being fulfilled!

[livealive]

A couple of notes (around 2:16): Thiele has already noted that Daniel uses Tishri to Tishri accession reckoning, which was common in Judah and among the exiles but contrasts with the Nisan-Nisan reckoning used by Jeremiah and the Babylonians. As such, for six months out of every year the calendars appear out of sync. The year in question according to the reckoning of Daniel and Judah was the accession year of Nebuchadnezzar II, and Berossus indicates Nebuchadnezzar II took Jewish captives to Babylon when he traveled home to secure the throne. Secondly, Daniel does not distinguish Media and Persia as separate empires. In chapter 6 as well as in chapter 8, references is made to the law of the Medes and Persians which cannot be altered. Ezra likewise refers to the law in similar fashion--the laws of the Persians and Medes, which ought not be altered.

Assyriologists have also long since recognized that Assyrian and Babylonian kings would refer to any one of their predecessors as their ex-officio father, even in the case where there is no blood relation, and a multitude of examples can be given. The phrase "the king my father" or "kings my fathers" is very common in Assyrian documents to speak of royal predecessors, even by usurpers (e.g. Tiglath-pilessar and Sargon II). Even Nabonidus, who claims that "kingship was not in me, " refers to Nebuchadnezzar as his "royal ancestor" and in the Nabonidus Cylinder he refers to his predecessors as "kings my fathers." Nabonidus and Nebuchadnezzar likewise refer to their predecessors as "kings my fathers." In contrast, Nebuchadnezzar refers to his own father as "the father my begetter." In addition, Nabonidus was not in Babylon when it fell. He was holed up in Borsippa. He did not return to Babylon until after it was captured. It has been recognized by Assyriologists (Dougherty, Beaulieu) that the "king" who was killed in the Greek histories refers to Belshazzar. Nabonidus, on the other hand, lived out the rest of his life in Carmania.

[jeffreynunes]

Wont be able to see it live but you can bet i will be back😀 In the mean time i left a like.

[sazbill]

This is really fascinating. I always wondered how scholars determined some of the things you discuss.

[michaelsommers]

I'm sure a True Believer would say that the appearance of "What's up?" in Shakespeare would simply prove that he saw the future accurately.

[williammoore]

At 3:26, you made a mistake. Lion is Babylon, the Bear is Medo/Persia, Leopard is Greece and the 4th beast is Rome.

[charmander]

okay so if there are so many historical inaccuracies in the book of Daniel, wouldn't it show that it was written before the events it claims to prophesy? i mean, the author could have make it much more accurate had he written is after the events occurred (it doesn't make sense for him to intentionally introduce inaccuracies since it would weaken his ability to convince people that the prophecies did indeed occur).