Unlocking the secrets of LOUDNESS

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[markym]

Wow. This is one of the most intriguing videos on the subject of home cinema. I look forward to seeing what your investigation comes up with Matthew. Good work!

[Risandi_Pradipto]

I've been thinking about this subject for the last two months, Moreover, after reading some of a streaming service white paper regarding their mixing reference level requirement (78-82 dB and 18 dB headroom). Thanks for this video, Matt. For someone working on this field, you are very kind to disclose this data. Keep it up. Can't hardly wait for the updates.

[MyFatherLoves]

I noticed this exact issue the other day when doing a final peak SPL check on a system using John Wick 4. If you calibrated a system to 85db, with a -20dbfs signal, and your processor's input source volume is set to -0db.... The beginning of John Wick 4 far surpasses 105db peaks for speakers and it far surpasses 115db on subs. This is confirmed when it goes to the next scene when John is chasing dudes on horseback. The gun shots register 105db peaks and subs peak around 115db.

I thought I was going crazy.

[JonasEliasson.]

I am with you 100% on this one! 👍🏼 This is depressing, for sure. I mean, like for me and many other enthusiasts i have a dedicated room build to almost perfection. With top of the line speakers, thx baffle wall, word class woven acoustic transparent screen, room acoustics and a separate apparatus room with good amplification and a Trinnov Altitude. I’m not rich, i am a working class man but this is my hobby my passion! And it didn’t happend over a night. And now they mixing the sound for kids with mobile phones. Sadly 🥺

[scott]

I’m finding that the same movie from two different streaming services have vastly different dynamic ranges. It’s not consistent, just specific movies.

Back in the day, when LP was our only source, I had a compander (compressor/expander). It tried to filter out the high frequency record hiss when the source was a low volume and expand the dynamic range the rest of the time. It wasn’t huge, but it helped. Records only had about 35 dB of dynamic range.

[vjm]

Matthew, the rabbit hole goes deep on this one and you're in the middle of it!
Some other things to consider:
a. It's been kicked around that smaller rooms will sound louder for some reason, that's why there is the 82db standard of mixing in nearfield, there's actually a ATSC chart depending on the cubic feet of the room, i.e. 1, 500 < 4, 999 cubic feet is 78db.
b. One of the major differences between streaming and disk/Kscape is streaming will use Dialnorm on the DD+ stream, most times a setting of -4 but could be more, for example The Fall Guy has a -6 Dialnorm setting, which means it's 6db lower in volume than the disk/Kscape version.

[Beetlecop]

This happens for music streaming too, I worked with a sound engineer who would be tasked to spec different mixes on whatever he was working for based on destination, i.e. Spotify, CD, Apple, etc with subtle changes required for each.

[ThatguyPanda]

The internet’s most underrated acoustician. I started listening to you from your first Audioholics and Earl Geddes related appearances and am thrilled you’re still out here distributing knowledge based on empirical, quantifiable data as opposed to so many in the A/V world that have a very loose definition of scientific and snake oil

[antonioh]

Matt, I recall from a Audioholics chat with a Hollywood sound engineer that there is a near-field and far-field mix. The near-field mix is used for streaming as you mentioned. However, the sound engineer mentioned that the far-field mix gets used for Blu-ray and Kaleidescape. He mentioned that the far-field mix is typically 6bs higher than the near-field and that animation movies are additional 3dbs lower for near-field mixes. But that may change over the past two years.

[Zachary_Setzer]

Great info as usual. There does seem to be some variance from one movie to the next on this. Some things sound right at 0db, others sound way louder than anything you would hear in a commercial cinema and something closer -5 or even to -10db sounds right.

I never considered the difference in mixing levels for TV programming.

[erod]

Great, great topic and thank you for taking this on! Look forward to your findings.

[FURognar]

I calibrate to 85db, but I usually listen at about -15db. I have my main volume limited to -10 max.

[adamjj]

I just keep an SPL meter handy in the theater and always set my volume based on that instead of just using the scale on the processor. Like you said, different sources are all over the place when it comes to mastering.

[geickmei]

Good one Matt - of course, we can set our volume levels to taste no matter what they do, but some good info!

[Iank]

I comprehended more after a second view. I heard that some streaming services might be cutting the lower bass . Saving on data storage I guess.

[MyFatherLoves]

I look forward to the findings of your results!

[darrenchase]

Thank you for doing this i been waiting for a video like this for a long time

[steakhoux]

I would guess that a rock concert would be far mor dangerous for your hearing than watching some movies. The dynamic compression of movies for residential is a big bummer though. I always found out ref level way too loud that's also why I (and maybe some other people) asked how it can be that their speakers would not be able to reach this when it is already too loud at -10 db.

[chandan]

Denon receivers have a dialnorm defeat option. which would make streaming mixes as loud as the regular bluray versions .

[PIPERBOYWILLIAMS]

I see why you’re rich. You’re incredibly analytical. Eye opening video.