Is Modern Shimano Sora Better Than Retro Dura-Ace?

How long does it really take for trickle down technology to reach the lower echelons? Tech Editor Simon Smythe has put the current era Shimano Sora 3300 up against his faithful Dura-Ace 7700 to answer that very question. Both are 9 speed groupsets, both use rim brakes and both are mechanically operated. So the questions stands, how much difference really is there? Well it seems there's a quite a lot; Dura-Ace is lighter, shifts more smoothly and looks better but Sora does still have it's benefits like fully integrated routing and better ergonomics. Which one would you have?

00:00 - Intro
00:20 - What's the test?
02:16 - Weight & Ratios
05:04 - Ergonomics
05:27 - Aesthetics
06:29 - Riding test
09:23 - Braking test
10:50 - Shifting feel
11:14 - Verdict
12:23 - Outro

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#cycling #bikes #bicycles

[stefanwagener]

Somewhat interesting comparison but the difference in timing probably comes mostly from the different rolling resistance of the tires and not from the group set.

[rp]

Should have used the same wheels and tyres for both tests

[fennec]

Sora has got to win this one for me. I rode my first 3000 miles on my first drop bar bike on Sora, before upgrading. The gear range, the nice cable routing, Hallowtech BB and how bomb-proof and durable it is... This is a groupset that comes on gravel bikes in the $1, 000 range, btw.

The old Dura ace is pretty, but a relic of the past. the parts; not replaceable, and only takes smaller cassettes. Your colnago is now more like a museum piece that one is afraid to get a scratch on.

The point isn't which is "better" they're both amazing, but nowadays no one gives and credit to just how really good Claris and Sora are and how AVAILABLE and affordable they are. The old 9 speed Dura ace, isn't.
Not every rider needs a $12, 000 sram red or Dura ace bike carbon bike.

[amitkumar-wjgn]

I think the biggest trickle down is the way Claris and Sora look compared to the previous models. Not to mention, the fact that you get the same range (more or less) on a Sora as you do in 105.

[PekkaTahkola]

I've still got my old 1997 Dura-ace 7700 levers and rear derailleur in my 2010 Tarmac S-Works. They're amazing and I've never ever felt the need to "up"grade them to anything else 🥰

[howardleckey]

For me cycling at a rather older age, I find myself enjoying all the sensations and feel of the equipment. To me the silky smooth, precise and always reliable dura ace is my choice

[ferhatpehlivan]

I cycle 50 km a day on a Sora equipped bike 250 days a year. I think the Sora 3000 is great for everyday use, but of course it's incomparable with a 105 and up. When the Sora3000 is deformed, the replacement cost is also very affordable :)

[isitrachelorj]

Somewhere on YT there is a video of a Yates brother/ Matt Stephens vid out for a ride and Simon/Adam are on old 9 speed Sora doing off-season miles and extolling it's virtues. Good enough for the pros, good enough for the rest of us. Race-Day bike is a different story!

[paulgorman]

Two very important things for me: number one touch points. I have ridden both shift levers back to back many times. The older dura ace levers are abysmal compared to the newer levers. I ride on the hoods a lot. I would choose the newer levers every time. Number two, gear ratios. Since both high end gear ratios are nearly the same that is not an issue. However, a low gear, such that I can spin it up hills is now my preference. Use the heart and lungs, save the legs! On long climbs I can to try to keep my cadence about 80 RPMs. 30 years ago that wasn’t a thing. We pushed. Watch a video of Greg LeMond and Bernard Hinault climbing together, you’ll see what I mean. When we first watched Miguel Indurain climbing we thought what is he doing spinning that fast? It was at that moment we realized that On long climbs method was more efficient and faster. Jim Ocowiczs statement that Low is slow went out the window.

[jeffreyclark]

After my DA 7800 gave out I switched to the 4700 Tiagra (10 speed) and immediately it was apparent that it was a major upgrade. I wanted to stay with 10 speed and this was my option.

[Roweromaniak]

In 2009 I bought a used bike equipped with 7700 DA. It was used by a professional Polsih cyctlist since 2002 (from the data I managed to collect) on his training bike. I used this groupset on three different framesets since then. I do not know how many km the previous owner did on his bike, but this DA went through a lot. From local races on road and CX courses to long trainings in harsh winter conditions on salted roads. It is still running perfectly. No service, no maintenance. I've never opened the lever mechanisms... According to my training notes I've driven about 50 000 km using my 7700. There are some scars, but there is no play while trying to put some force on the front and rear derraileur. The only problem I've got is that it is really dofficult to buy new bracket covers :D
The only thing I always did was to put the gears on the smallest cog on the cassette and small chainring after each ride... Thats all :)
None of the newer groupsets lasted that long with me...

[solitaryrefinement]

I started out with Sora/Tiagra on my first bike. It was great until it wasn't. As my abilities grew and I put more demand on it, I realized I needed something better. I went to full Dura-Ace 7800 and the change was night & day. Today, I have Dura-Ace 9100, 105, Acera, GRX and on my vintage Tommasini Super Prestige, Dura-Ace 7400. I bought it as a project bike to work on. The drivetrain was rusted shut. Last week, I began working on it and readying myself to remove the drivetrain to replace it with something else and as I broke it free with some WD40 followed up by some citrus degreaser, something wonderful happened...the groupset came alive.

I kept brushing it and spraying it and in no time, this 3 decades old Dura-Ace 7400 (FULL 7400 from the brakes to the crankset to the headset to the hubs) began to shift perfectly, precisely, quietly and smoother than anything else I had in my stable. It was the most accurately operating groupset on any of my bikes.

Sure, the latest 105 is eons above anything in that era in matters of ergonomics and feel, but I still contend that Shimano's 7800 groupset was their best by far. It was the best mechanically, it was the last groupset to be all metal construction and aesthetically, it belongs in The Louvre as it's bits are for all intents and purposes jewelry for bicycles. They are works of art. The shifters are feminine, the derailleurs are masculine and the pedals are like The Terminator in liquid form.

Today's groupsets are great, but nothing feels as nice as the all metal groupsets of yesteryear and nothing feels as gratifying as riding a bike that doesn't have a finicky, temperamental drivetrain that gets out of wack too easily. Old groups are like timepieces. They last forever if properly maintained.

Moving forward, all my bike builds will be with 105 from now on. It's near Dura-Ace performance at 1/3 the price and that's hard to argue with. Plus, it lasts a lot longer. All my bikes are spec'd with Ultegra cassettes because it offers the best combination of smoothness, engagement & durability in my opinion.

Great comparison by the way. Very thorough and well thought out.

And regarding the Praxis crankset, Praxis chainrings are better than anything Shimano produces. I have them on all my bikes.

[pigeonpoo]

I applaud your commitment on the braking tests.
I don't like the look of cables coming out of the sides of the hoods, so sadly DA loses. And the winner is 105 5800 / r7000.

[domestique]

Love the 7700 groupset and actually have it on my winter bike—i even got my hands on some of the parts from Shimano’s 25th anniversary set like seatpost, cranks and bottom bracket-they have titanium parts and are polished.
The STI work flawlessly for more than 2 decades now!
Although i must admit i hit the deck very hard when my right and hollow crank broke in a sprint....😱

[parmijo]

It would help to have both bikes on the same tires/tubes. The colnago is on Michelin Pro3 which have a much lower rolling resistance compared to the specialized road sport tires. Any speed/time difference could simply be the tires/tubes.

[RandallStarr-lllw]

Great timing! I just replaced my 2004 Ultegra 9 speed rear for a new Sora 9 speed long cage so that i can move from a 12-25 to a 12-32. I have no regrets. Shifts are smooth and the gears are truly well worth it.

[jonford]

The test comparisons are completely unscientific, and can only be viewed as a comprison between the two complete bikes, which says nothing about the groupset. Why is this? There is so much confounding with other components playing a part. Different wheels, frames and (especially) tyres all play such a role that the comparison of the groupsets is pretty much void.

The comment about the brakes offering the same braking as disks also completely misses the point. Decent rim brakes, well set up, can pretty much mach the braking performance of hydraulic disks in the dry. That's fine. But in the wet, the braking performance is massively different with much longer stopping distances for rim brakes, and far higher pull required.

Personally, if offered the choice between Dura-Ace 7700 and Sora 3300, I'd take the 7700 every time, mainly as it's subjectively a nicer thing. But given the choice between Dura-Ace 7700 and current 105, it's be the 105 which won out.

[bikeman]

I have Sora on my winter bike. Saves a fortune on chains and cassettes. A worn in Sora has a butter smooth change. A 11-34 cassette also works.

[TeilzeitSender]

Honestly u can really feel the Dura Ace quality, especially in the long term. Also Love to service my Dura Ace...

[mantelles]

Hi, That Comnago is simply beautiful, interesting testing.