Why I don't use an Avalanche Airbag Backpack (ABS) // DAVE SEARLE

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Here's some thoughts and reasons behind why I don't use an ABS Avalanche airbag for skiing and ski mountaineering.

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Dave, I appreciate your thoughts on this topic. I have heard several guides and forecasters share these similar opinions. That being said, every year we loose industry professionals to avalanches. This conversation is close to my heart - a few years ago I fell through a cornice, down a 100’ cliff then engulfed in an avalanche for an 800’ ride (the slide ran for 1600’ size 3) My airbag saved my life. Thank you for all the informative content.

EightyYears
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I understand your view. I don't entirely agree but my situation is different. I ski in a continental snowpack and I'm on SAR. So I certainly accept the concept that with the things you do and the way you do them, it's not useful to you, but I have lots of thoughts on your argument.

Belayed slope cutting is a good mitigation in a place dominated by wind and storm slabs. That strategy might work very well in your applications. It's a lot less useful here with mostly persistent slabs.

I disagree with the redundancy argument. Airbags act by a different mechanism, and serve to further reduce risk beyond BSP. For example, you wouldn't say a shovel is redundant even though technically, you can dig with your hands or skis. The shovel adds further risk reduction.

Then there's the weight. Airbags add 1-1.5kg to a bag usually (I'm trying to do metric, though I'm an American). That's something you can feel, but realistically, I'm around 100kg with all my gear, 1% isn't going to make the difference between whether or not I can ski out of an avalanche.

Finally, the argument about taking more risk is incorrect in my view. It's been made about every single item of safety gear ever invented (seatbelts, helmets, you name it). Does carrying BSP make you take more risks? How about a first aid kit? Or a helmet? I'd also say that if that's the sort of thing influencing the risks you accept, a more systematic decision making approach can help to solve that.

The product this argument applies to is Safeback. That thing is straight up dangerous (the fact that people die in shallow burials all the time shows their whole theory of operation to be wrong). The far cheaper Avalung was probably the better version of such a product, but no one wants to have that in their mouth all the time.

Cost is the biggest issue for airbags. For the price of one airbag, you can have a whole set of quality ski backpacks and that's tough to swallow. It's far too much to bear for more niche applications (so I don't have one I can overnight with because it's too much money for something I'd use only a few times per season).

mediocrehat
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This is a very well put together, and thought provoking video.

I've heard the same argument applied to mountain bike helmets; that the safety they provide emboldens riskier behaviour. While that does play a role for some people, most people are risk averse enough that the effect of the safety item is even greater in scenarios where they made the "safest" choice, and still ended up in a bad situation.

In other words, the mountains have so much risk that even safe decisions can put us in dangerous scenarios. So the protection provided by an ABS in the situations we can't avoid, is far greater than the false sense of security they provide in the situations we do choose.

In regards to your point about carrying other gear, it's not a substitute. Your shovel isn't going to dig you out of a slide, it digs OTHER people out. An ABS is the only thing one can carry (besides the good decision making you mentioned) that will actively help them in a slide. Everything else, including beacons, requires other people's actions to work.

kaneshillingford
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I appreciate the context you give for the types of decisions you're making. I find it very relateable. For me, most tours an airbag would be excessive gear that may not make sense for the conditions, terrain, or objectives we are skiing.

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I think (maybe wrong) the reality is, that most people out there - me included with my 30 days/year and maybe 10 days/year off piste - cannot assess the risk to a high degree of certainty. Although that has recently become better with more detailed online reporting and so on. Me and most of those people, still ski 30-40° slopes when the avalanche risk level is around 2-3 (Austrian scale). I mean most relatively experienced guys know how to read the avalanche report, how to avoid mentioned exposures at mentioned altitudes etc., they can somewhat read conditions + terrain on the mountain and so on. And sometimes they can even resist and turn around, if they feel it's too dangerous. But very few are experts in avalanche assessment and make errors.

However I agree with airbags sometimes leading to people taking more risk.
Tough one.

And obviously that 1.X kg extra is annoying too.
At least gear has gotten a fair bit lighter. Pretty confident one of the latest high end airbag backpacks, with fancy light stuff in it, weighs the same as your normal pack would have 10 years ago. Plus ski's, boots and bindings have gotten lighter, without sacrificing performance (not always of course...). Just bloody water doesn't get lighter, but most of that is thankfully gone, when it's time for the decent, ha :D

Felix-mrvs
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Problem is: you may not have a second chance to change your mind. That's the game we play. Experience and safety due diligence doesn't cancel risk, we need to move away from this thinking. Avalanches are way too complex to be 100% avoided and having an avbag is definitely a plus for increasing survival odds in case we get caught. But sure it's not magical, and it has its drawbacks (weight, size). So it's a personal choice as you stated. I wear one most of the time, but not always. I value my safety more than convenience.

benorfaz
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I'm an avalanche instructor and I fully agree with you! cheers Dave🤙

SeekingSnow
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I refuse to invest too much due to anxiety, but preparing safety equipment that assumes various variables is reassuring not only for me but also for my tour partner. Avalanche education, equipment, usage, weather, and terrain familiarity are basics, but I think airbags are a good choice as an additional option (snowy, short tours, and advanced terrain).

byungsunkim
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I hear these arguments forwarded frequently, and they don't make a lot of sense to me. "Risk compensation" can be equally applied to beacons and helmets (along with all other safety devices, such as airbags in cars). Recent studies are showing survival improvements are improved by as much or more than carrying a beacon, and very few of us would ski avalanche terrain without a shovel/beacon/probe (which is itself an example of risk compensation). Plan A should always be to avoid burial, but we see careful, well educated industry professionals end up in avalanche accidents every season.

I don't always run my airbag, largely for the weight and bulk points you make up front and because it's pointless weight if avalanche risk is high and I'm entirely avoid avalanche terrain. I've never thought "oh, triggering a slide here wouldn't matter - I've got an airbag on!" I appreciate the content you're putting out, but disagree with you here, but I am often riding less technical - more freeride oriented terrain as you mention in the video, and those days where I've got a full rope and technical gear I'm way less likely to opt for it.

lukehwright
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I do not carry an ABS when doing a multi day backcountry ski tour here in the US where I have to carry a tent, sleeping bag and food for multiple days. I also do not carry abs when skiing inbounds. However on day tours with higher than low avalanche danger I highly recommend using an abs bag. Latest avalanche education clearly states that trees do not protect from avalanches. That anchorung statement made in the video is not correct. I started to wear a ski helmet once I had kids and remembered some pretty darn falls on my head. For the sake of your kids use an abs bag as long as it is not too tough to do. In Chamonix you have a lot of lift access and do not need to climb 3000 or 4000 feet with tent and all other equipment in your bag.

butzlafffamily
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Just wanted to share a potential video topic idea. Discussing ski carry while climbing ice and mixed terrain A-Frame, Diagonal, and for splitboarders vertical. I see many folks using a true side carry these days which seems like it would add 4-6 extra pounds to a single side of the body (please correct if wrong) but might be nice if you are in a dihedral for example. It seems like most carry's would work for ice. Maybe its not worth a video but if you have any feedback I would be all ears to hear it!

RangerDanger
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Its so refreshing to hear somebody with your profile articulate the correct logic that prevention is better than cure, and that people shouldn't increase their risk taking because they are carrying a piece of technology that 'might' stop them from getting buried. If you are asking yourself "would i ski this line without an airbag" then you should not be skiing it at all! people with airbags still die every year from massive trauma or deep burial in terrain traps. While i have no data to back this up, i really wouldn't be surprised if airbags have led to more fatalities in the mountains as they are giving people a false sense of security.

chamonixskibum
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Not needing it for terrain type, objective type, weight, etc. makes sense. However, the idea that you don't want it because you believe it will lead to a more careless mindset is a damaging philosophy to share with others. It is the same point people made about helmets and seatbelts before they became the norm. It is a proven piece of kit that saves lives, simple as that.

wrinkle
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Airbags are only designed to prevent burial, the theory is that you will become a larger volume particle among the chunks of moving snow and due to the property of “inverse segregation” in physics; a larger surface area particle will be forced upward in a granular, uniform flow(pieces of snow sliding down slope in an avalanche). However pulling the airbag is usually the last thing that someone does in the seconds and milliseconds after getting captured and can actually cause you to give up the ability to fight for your life and kick and swim to perhaps be deposited on the bed surface or flank of the avalanche while the snow continues down. So most of the time the airbag is deployed and then the captured person rides in the avalanche to the bottom of its track being subjected to the possible trauma of bouncing off rocks/trees/washed over cliffs, into crevasses ect. While burial leading to asphyxiation is the number one cause of death in avalanche accidents, serious injuries from trauma comes in second. Dave you make a good point about the pace you move through the mountains being an important factor, heli skiing it makes sense for clients and maybe even guides to wear air bags. They are moving so fast into consequential terrain with minimal input before hand to determine the slope’s stability, getting caught off guard is frankly more likely. Weight is also a major issue, show me a high level ski mountaineer who uses an airbag on every objective, they are just too heavy when it comes to climbing technical terrain or walking long distances with lots of gear where every ounce counts. The point is your best chance at surviving an avalanche is to not be captured in one, an airbag may help you avoid getting buried if caught off guard but is by no means a cure all for all the possible dangers. I would disagree with your reasoning of “never seeing someone close to being buried in x amount of years where you ski” as a good point though, anything can happen and familiarity in decision making is a deadly heuristic trap. If I remember correctly from an older issw paper, the statistics of survival in the Alps with abs bags was a higher data set than the Canadian and US Rockies perhaps due to terrain and trauma. I worked as a heli ski guide in alaska when abs packs were becoming ubiquitous and while the company moved toward supplying every client with one it was always the guide’s choice if they personally used one, in 2012 I think about 25% of guides at our outfit used them. Im no longer a guide, curious if more guides use them these days

Weed_Mountain
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I have a more of a cynical opinion on this. ABS slightly increase the chance of survival of yourself, especially when you fuck up your evaluations on the terrain (I guess that not all your audience is made of experienced professional Mountain guides) or when the avalanches are triggered by unpredictable circumstances (like distance-triggered avalanches), so I would recommend anyway, especially for freeriding.

giovannisguotti
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A lot of people need to realise the difference between 'working' outdoors and 'playing' outdoors. The decision making and even the way you conduct yourself working is very different because you're responsible for consequences that affect others who are relying on you, not just yourself. And ABS bag is around the 700g mark and about the size of a hardshell rolled up into it's own hood (going by Mammut's rABS3) so it's a difficult call to make. A similar case can be made for buoyancy aid in whitewater kayaking. You could argue the restriction of movement and heat are inhibitive, and that having one on can cloud your situational judgement. But the /actual/ reality is not the case, you just assume them as part of the situation as no amount of 'I' responses can help you /when/ you're in aerated water. Note the use of /when/ rather than 'if'. Helmets similarly mitigate the 'when' rather than try to mitigate the 'if'. While it's important to mitigate the 'if' to a reasonable amount, it is /very/ dangerous to convince ourselves we have the 'when' covered by fact of just probability-ing it out of existence, whatever the activity or environment. But the truth remains that when shit hits the fan, solutions designed to mitigate the 'when' of the situation are significantly more valuable than solutions designed to mitigate the 'if' of the situation. Things like ABS bags aren't /compulsory/ but we should take the decision to not carry them with full consideration of wether you'd be happy with your decision making if the worse case happening despite your best measures in place.

I don't guide in the alps, but a member of the MTUK board once told me "Take the reasoning behind your decision and put 'your honour' after it. Because if you're wrong, that's what you're going to have to say. If you sound stupid, you're right."

_burd
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Great explanation and thought processes! Mirrors my own. I don't take it on personal tours, but would use one when working for a heli-company or in freeride style of days.
Here in interior BC it's an interesting topic as well - the bulk of our skiing is below treeline, and majority of avalanche injuries and fatalities are due to trauma (cliffs and trees), not burrial. Airbags have some minimal benefits as a protective barrier, but are not designed for trauma protection.

Drewski
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Thanx Dave for being honest on this topic. This winter I was in a training course to become an alpine winter instructor at the duth mountainering club. Everybody had an ABS, accept me, I had my lightweigt daypack or 30lt BD. With the same reasons as you. Ive seen them skiing/touring things where I would withdraw. Ive been skiing and touring in the backcountry and high alpine terrain for +60 weeks, partly professionally trained. But they made me feel irresponsable, whilest I find them so😅!

Love your content, thanx mate💪🎿👏

nanneboekholt-thehappyathletes
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Great thoughtful insights. Based on your terrain choice and preference (AND experience) it makes good sense

benjamingass
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Hi Dave, great video as always! Look forward to seeing more!

This video could end up being polarising but I totally understand your point and it is quite sensible. The only thing I don't quite agree with is putting beacon+probe+shovel in the same exact category as the ABS bag: the former can't replace the latter and viceversa, so I wouldn't look over the ABS system just because I already carry beacon, probe and shovel.

The ABS system is a formidable piece of kit and (looking at the available data) it does make a difference IF you get avalanched, so it should be a no-brainer, but I totally understand that it could give a false sense of security and ultimately raise the acceptable risk level. Also, I totally understand that its weight and additional bulk isn't always acceptable if you have to skin or climb a fair bit.

For me the best take from this video should be the following: if you look at risk management in a more holistic way, and not just at the individual pieces of equipment, the ABS bag can/should be left at home some times. As you mentioned, conservative choices, continuous assessment of the conditions, rope-assisted ski cuts or inspections can provide a more than reasonable safety level without adding an excessive load on the back (which could end up being more risky as you become slower and less agile).


Thanks for the videos and interesting discussions!
Luca

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