Why did Saruman team up with Mordor? #lotr_qa

Middle Earth Lore

Gandalf, Tolkien, Wizards, Rings of Power, LOTR, Lord of the Rings, Return of the King, Hobbits, Frodo, Bilbo, Saruman, Sauron, Valar, Maiar, Valinor, Mordor

[xantherxavier]

When I was a kid my dumbass thought that Saruman joined Sauron because their names were similar

[pupper]

Well, it's not Boromir's plan or idea - it's Denethor's plan. And interestingly, both Denethor and Saruman were abusing the palantir. So it's possible that both Denethor and Saruman were manipulated by Sauron to adopt this stupid plan of using the One Ring against Mordor.

[nadiahapsari]

Funny how both Saruman & Dooku are basically trying to do the same thing and failed all the same

[wjzav]

Imagine that working out and Saruman returning to the gods being like "Hey, it worked all out, didn't it."
And the gods being like: "Explain what happened to the men, women and children of Rohan, please."

[Uriahakabrowndog]

I just figured Saruman joined Sauron because he was more likely to win the War of the Ring, in his opinion at least

[stewardofconsciousness]

I thought in the movie it was pretty clear that Saruman only temporarily wanted to ally himself with Sauron, at least that was the vibe I got.

[liljenborg]

I gotta disagree with you there.
Saruman no longer saw himself as Sauron's foe, and his desire for the ring was not as the best way to defeat Sauron so he could return to the West having successfully completed his mission.
He had started to see himself as Sauron's RIVAL.
As Treebeard says, he was plotting to become "a Power". His desire for the Ring had grown out of his own research into how the rings were made and his envy that Gandalf had been given one of the Three.
You can also see this in the way he treats Rohan. He want to RULE them. He sees them not as allies who can help him defeat his enemy, but merely as subjects who should bow before his innate superiority.

This also is a part of why, once he started using the Palantir to try and spy on Sauron, Sauron was able to completely manipulate him until he turns Orthanc into a "child's model or slaves flattery" of Barad Dur. His purposes had been twisted to align with Sauron's rather than the Valar who had sent him.

[keddiemeal]

Gandalf: (Glanced at Saruman) "There is only one Lord of the Ring. Only one who can bend to his will and he does not share power." (Jumps off the Isengard tower and rescued by Gwaihir the Windlord)

and that's why I choose Gandalf over and over

[Veklim]

This is true at first only, after DECADES of his using the palantir he had been utterly warped and corrupted by Sauron's influence. This is evidenced by Gandalf's return as the white, Iluvatar straight up replaced Saruman because of the fall from grace.

[TurinTuramber]

Saruman of many colours: Equips Saruman's ring

+10 Arrogance
-10 Humility

*Special Effect: Delusion*

[JamesTobiasStewart]

I saw a great point about that. Saruman managed to put himself in a terrible position, because by send the Uruk-Hai to retrieve the Ring (with instructions to bring it back to him) he makes an enemy of Sauron (who would not be fooled by any excuse of: "wanting to retrieve it for you master"), while also making himself an enemy of the Free People's with his betrayal of Gandalf and his assault on Rohan.

Saruman made himself an enemy of both sides, gambling on a plan that hinged on far too many things going PERFECTLY for him. The biggest of course being that the One Ring would obey him and not simply manipulate and betray him like all the other Non-Sauron ringbearers.

[GrandSupremeDaddyo]

The guy kept getting Amazon packages for Saru... Saur... Soor... Scary evil guy in a tower, and eventually he just said "fine yeah that's me".

[casbot]

It was because Saruman had seen that he would join the Sith, and he got his franchisees mixed up.

[TheDJMeyer]

I thought it started that way but slowly Saruman essentially became a goon for Sauron without even realizing it

[zam]

The running theme throughout the books is the corrupting power of that dang ring

[mistergenin]

Just like Aragorn's said, the ring only answers to it's Master which is Sauron alone.

[blairm]

Also saruman also made his own ring and then slowly became corrupted just like the rest.

[Voltaic_Fire]

He was possibly the single worst double agent ever.

[sheuerman]

So basically sauron just corrupted Saruman into doing what sauron wanted lol that’s some 220iq play right there

[Serai]

If they could only use one mention of the Palantir, it would have made far more sense to include it in Denethor's story than Saruman's. Being a wizard, we really didn't need an exact explanation of how he would know what he did and how he was contacting Sauron. But without the Palantir, Denethor just came off as a callous, grumpy, cruel asshole, instead of a noble soul weighed down by a lifetime of war and Sauron's dark gaslighting. I think it would have been an even better film if we'd been shown that he was being influenced, more tragic. (Also, ye gods, the Flambe Run. Don't think I'll ever forgive PJ for that clownish death.)