How To Reduce Oxidation in New England IPA - Brew Dudes

Oxidation in New England IPA is a real problem. This week, we discuss ways to reduce it.

We have been getting several questions about oxidation in NEIPA lately. We through in this video we would discuss observations and techniques we have used to be pretty successful in preventing our NEIPAs (or any beer) from turning a murky brown/purple mess with reduced hop aromatics.

Our gold standard is to transfer from fermentor to keg under a closed transfer system. What this means is that you move beer from one CO2 filled container (the fermentor) to another completely CO2 filled container (the keg).

We discuss the challenges faces with bottle conditioning as well as some of the chemical solutions to the problem that we've read and seen floating in various beer interweb places!

Tell us about your practices for limiting oxidation in your NEIPAs!

Cheers!

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#neipa #oxidation #beer

[diverbob]

I love it when Mike starts talking chemistry; it always brings back horrible memories from my college chemistry classes! For one, I remember walking into my first biochem class and seeing a bunch of dudes with beards, briefcases, and thick glasses and I thought to myself man I'm screwed!

[ZedTubeGaming]

Really interesting discussion, great video guys!

I have had several NEIPAs with underwhelming results because of oxidation. I can or bottle my beers from my brite tank, what I have found works best for me is to fill the brite tank with sanitiser and purge with o2 then I do a closed transfer from FV to brite tank using the PRV on the top of the tank to expel the co2 as it fills with beer from the bottom. I use a bottling/canning gun once the beer is ready to package purging each can/bottle with co2 before filling. Another thing to note is that I always dry-hop at day 2 or 3 while there is an active fermentation happening so that any o2 introduced with the dry hop should be used up by the yeast in the ferment. My last NEIPA turned out great so i think this process works well (for me anyway)

Something I read about recently on a forum somewhere (cant find the source) was a suggestion to use magnets either side of the wall to attach your dry hop bag on the inside of the FV (a sanitized magnet inside the hop bag and another on the outside) when you pitch your yeast. When you are ready to add the dry hop you remove the magnet from the outside letting gravity drop your hop bag into the beer, that way you can add a drop hop without having to open the FV - I am going to try this on my next brew as this is a novel approach and removes another potential o2 source.

[aaronsams]

Thanks for this! As a fellow chemist, I really appreciated the discussion of free-radicalization and the divalent cations. I have been really frustrated with all my hazy IPAs oxidizing very quickly. Fortunately, I tend to drink the beer before it gets too bad, but I'd like to get through a keg before the hop profile dies and long before I get to the notes of cardboard. I've long been considering getting a bigger CO2 tank and pushing everything rather than racking by siphon, and I think this might have pushed me to making that decision. Keep up the amazing videos! They certainly have helped me become a better homebrewer.

[chamiboy]

Hey, great video, this is my experience on bottle condition NEIPA, i fill bottles to the very top and never had bombs (first time i did it was only one bottle and keep that bottle in a safe place covered and no issues), also I'm starting experimenting 0.5-1g of ascorbic acid per gallon of finished beer and had no oxidation on bottling from a bucket, cheers.

[keifereef]

Always something to learn from your channel, and I always thought co2 was heavier 😬, I use a plastic bucket with tap to transfer into the keg through the keg post after pushing sanitiser out of the keg with co2, and have a keg post on the bucket lid so I can push co2 into the bucket, also when dry hopping the hops are suspended on the lid with magnets until I need them to go in, no reason to open the lid until the fermenter is empty. Great channel dudes keep the vids coming!

[johncrawford]

I’ve had great success bottling NEIPA without noticeable oxidation. I rack into bottles directly from the tap of my fermenter. I put priming sugar (~1/2tsp) and a tiny pinch of SMB into every bottle first, then use a bottling wand attached to my fermenter spigot to fill bottles from the bottom. Cap immediately after filling. No bottle purging with a beer gun necessary.

[SuziFranzen]

I'm attempting my 1st run @ and NEIPA and this helped me greatly! Nice Job guys and Thank You!!!

[jamesweltz]

Thanks, this is a great discussion. EDTA is a great idea to chelate some of the catalytic divalent cations, I will have to try that. As seen on brulosophy, I have used potassium metabisulfite (campden) as a reducing agent with a lot of luck at concentrations significantly less than many commercial wines. I think a combination of EDTA and metabisulfite would provide excellent flavor stability.

[diverbob]

I also really appreciate Mike's comments about ascorbic acid. There's another YT channel were the guys not only recommend it but they say that always add it to their kegs of any IPA they brew as a standard practice. I'm not going to name them but they also have their own brew pub (lucky stiffs)!

[TheKlamminator]

I use absorbic acid and close transer. Those two things really helped my oxidation problems. I've also pressure fermented in a keg which has also had good results.

[fredrikwesterberg]

I ferment under pressure directly in the corny keg with a spundit valve. I've cut the dip tube so I can serve directly from the keg or bottle with a beer gun. No transfer = no O2

[scottnau]

Another interesting topic, great job. For bottling best way is to ferment and carbonate under pressure in the same vessel and then fill bottles with a counter pressure bottle filler from said vessel. Absolute zero contact with o2 this way.

[thetommyandbobbyshow]

Love the reviews, guys! Keep em coming!! We should have you on our show one of these days!

[ChuckUnderFire]

In my experience the Starsan I have keeps for WEEKS. If not more like months. I basically always keep it in one of my kegs and rotate it around with pressure transfers from keg to keg and top it off to the VERY RIM for the little bits that are lost. So one 6 gal batch of starsan will last me at least a couple rotations through keg cycles. I only toss it once it looks funky (which takes a while when it only ever touches clean kegs) or if the pH rises out of range (3.6+).

[dwainpannell]

Here’s a note I received from Joe Formanek (home brewers extraordinaire and rep for Brewtan B):

You are exactly right! The divalent ions such as Cu or Fe+2 interact with free oxygen in the system and via Fenton’s Reaction processes generate free radicals which cascade to oxidize the system.

Reduction or removal of these ions reduce the incidence of these reactions regardless of the level of oxygen present.

Remember, though, that not all ions are removed, which is OK because some are important for proper yeast functionality. So a combination of oxygen reduction and ion removal is the best case scenario. Tannic acid is not so much an oxygen scavenger as it is an ion remover, so if there is oxygen present it will not have as much of an effect. This has worked well in systems where there is an inherent high level of DO due to equipment used.

Using Tannic acid as a mash water treatment helps remove the divalent ions right from the start of the mash and reduces the free radical cascade right from the start.

Cheers!
Joe

[herbstava]

Liking the chemistry talk here fellas! Regarding the divalent cations though, you mentioned Zn(II) and Mg(II). Both of those cations are redox inactive at the temperature and pH of beer (and really most conditions on Earth!). The thermodynamic "well" for both of these cations prevents any redox chem. Additionally, neither really like to grab molecular oxygen at the concentration that it would be at in the liquid phase (pretty low concentration and they don't have any unpaired electrons where oxygen does). I would imagine that the Fe(II) and Cu(II) present are the perpetrators for superoxide formation (as seen with wine and widely utilized as cofactors for enzymes).

I've been wondering though; do you guys think that the oxidation seen with hazys is the oxidation of polyphenols to quinones?

P.s.- by every 10 degrees C the rxn increases by 2x. This is just an approximation but in practice it's actually pretty good!

[Shreddah]

The correct way to add asorboric acid is on the cold side, either when pitching the yeast, dry hopping, or when bottling or in the keg. I had great success with these methods, even when bottle conditioning. Don't know why you only brought up adding it to the mash.

[jimmythekidd]

I don't currently keg and just use PET plastic bottles as I'm just starting out doing 1 gallon BIAB batches. To avoid oxidisation I fill the bottles from the bottom trying not to splash. I then remove the bottling wand and squeeze the bottle so the beer is at the brim of the bottle. I then cap it off with a screw cap whilst the bottle is still squeezed. The bottles are misshapen after this, but as the beer carbonates the bottles expand out again to their normal shape which also gives a good indication that carbonation is happening.

[dazza]

Nice vid dudes! I see Gash Slug has just done a vid where he mentions the use of Sodium Metabisulphite as a O2 scavenger.

[andrewlutton]

Instead of siphoning from fermenter to keg, I have just invested in (not used yet) some John guest fillings to make a spigot near the bottom of the fermenter. I intend to clip it straight to the beer out side of the keg and leave the pressure release valve in the keg open. Hopefully a fairly clean transfer with benefit of less cleaning, however expecting some additional losses from the fermenter.