Carbide Turning Tools VS Traditional Bowl Gouge HSS Video

Carbide Turning Tools VS Traditional Bowl Gouge HSS Video
Which is better carbide or traditional turning tools? That's a good question with a complicated answer. Carbide scrapers are relatively new to the scene compared to the traditional high-speed steel HSS bowl gouge. But which tool is better? Let's see if we can figure out whether carbide turning tools or traditional HSS bowl gouges are best for YOU!

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Equipment Used in This Video

(the listings below are a better choice for bowl turning if you want to use carbide)
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If you are curious about, or already completely addicted to turning wood bowls, check out my website dedicated to the art and craft of turning wood bowls!

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*** TOOL SHARPENING FOR WOOD BOWL TURNING – ONLINE COURSE

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*** WOOD BOWL TURNING Start-to-Finish – ONLINE COURSE
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#woodturning #woodworking #turnawoodbowl

[familytaylor]

I'm the guy ( MIke) that thanked you three times for your video on using a bowl gouge. In this video OF COURSE you are exactly truthfully 100% HOW REFRESHING !

[rsv-code]

This is a really great video, wish I saw this years ago.

[jarrodderr]

I spent at least three months never looking to see where my bevel was. Then I found this channel. I’ve improved a thousand percent since learning my AhBC’s. This is awesome. Thank

[stuwest]

I just bought my first lathe. A Ricon 70-1420 VSR. I am a woodworker for many years and have never had room for a lathe however I have retired and moved so I now have a much larger shop and decided ro pull the trigger on a lathe. I am very excited to try it and I look to videos like this for tips and Knowledge. Thanks so much for the useful information and I look forward to seeing much more content from you!

[StephenOgle]

Great vid and it is the best comparison vid I have seen. Most are all partial to one or the other. Well done. However, I must disagree about your "con" on the bowl gouge. I would think that all woodshops would have a sharpening station of some sort and even then you would not have to spend multiple hundreds of dollars to be able to sharpen turning tools effectively. When I first started turning, most woodturners recommended an 80 grit wheel on a bench grinder. I just do not think sharpening is a con. It only takes a few seconds. About as long as it takes to loosen a carbide cutter, rotate, and retighten. I really liked your video and don't get me wrong. Use what you want, it is your shop. Take care and keep em coming.

[jerrystark]

You make good points that are consistent with my experiences.

When I recently started using a lathe, I began with (1) a Robert Sorby 5-piece woodturning set (without a bowl gouge), (2) the same set of small carbide scrapers that you show in the video, (3) and a low-speed 8" RIkon grinder. These were significant investments and it took a bit of time to get the funds together, but I do not regret any of these purchases.

At first, all I did was small spindle turnings. For this, the spindle roughing gouge and the small carbide scrapers worked well. I also learned to size my turned pieces to allow for the considerable sanding I had to do after using carbide tools. (I even made a carbide scraping tool using a "negative rake scraper carbide blade" and a handle I turned with carbide tools. I learned you cannot put a burr on a carbide blade, so the the tool is essentially a dull scraper. So, epic fail. The round carbide scraper works much better.)

Then, in fairly short order, I started doing some cross-grain turning and, even though I started out with smaller turnings, I found the carbide tools were most useful for certain types of detail work, like cutting tenons or squaring up interior faces of small boxes, lids, etc. For these things, my carbide tools work very well. However, I did not find them adequate for achieving smoothly-turned results. because they were always biting into and fighting the wood, especially the softer woods. Then there was all the heavy sanding and the loss of detail that can result -- and the damned dust!

When I started to get into small box and bowl turning, I started using bowl gouges. They have made a tremendous difference in both my interest in turning and in my ability to do either spindle or cross-grain turning. I am still at the beginning of my learning curve, to be sure, but I am learning new things daily that help me to work better and more efficiently with wood turning tools that cut rather than scrape.

I am also using the Oneway Wolverine sharpening setup on my grinder now and that makes a world of difference. As you said, you have to have a sharpening station and you have to sharpen traditional tools frequently. Sharp cutting tools offer the benefits of smoother finished surfaces and finer details. They also allow for quicker finish sanding with less dust. I was pretty good at hand sharpening, but the Oneway grinder accessory has been a real game changer for me.

I'll put it this way. Using a bench grinder, It is possible to sharpen wood turning tools well by hand; it is also disastrously easy to mess up woodturning tools very quickly with hand sharpening; further, it is difficult to get repeatable grind profiles by hand sharpening on a grinder. On the other hand, with almost no practice at all, it is easy to sharpen woodturning tools with the Oneway Wolverine setup AND it is not nearly as easy too screw up the tool as you sharpen it; further, it is easy to get repeatable grind profiles. This system -- or one like it -- will save you time, frustration, and quite a bit of expensive tool steel. How do you want to spend your time, sharpening or woodturning? For me that answer is easy.: woodturning (Next step, CBN wheels for the grinder. 👍👍)

BTW: Those who suggest, by implication, that scrapers are newer than modern bowl gouges have it precisely backwards. Scrapers are some of the very oldest of woodturning tools. Indeed, chisels were among the first tools used as scrapers and they can still be used as such. Skews quickly evolved from knives, chisels, and even hatchets. Bowl gouges like the ones you use with swept-back wings and 45-55-degree grinds are relatively newer tools, as you stated. The material application of carbide to scraping tools is, indeed, newer, but that is not the key point: woodturning scrapers, the techniques they require, and their limitations are as old as turning itself.

You made the central point very clearly: Scrapers scrape; gouges cut. The distinction is important. The more turning you do, the more you appreciate that distinction and the more likely you will turn to gouges, in my estimation, even though it will always be possible to turn wood with carbide scrapers. To each their own and good profit to all.

Thanks again for this informative and helpful video. Your videos and your online course on bowl turning have really helped me. (Still working on the skew, though.. 😎 )

[michaelogden]

I recently bought a carbide "shear scraper" tool just to experiment with carbide. I've been using conventional tools for years and I often shear scrape (actually not a scrape, but a very fine slice) with a bowl gouge. The carbide tool "bar" has a small bevel-like surface which, in theory, could help produce a slicing action. In my hands, the carbide tool bevel angle between nothing and a dig-in just about infinitesimal. But I'll keep practicing with scrap and cutoffs to see if we can be friends. 🙂Cheers! Great videos!

[jackwebb]

I just got my first lathe for Christmas. I have turned a total of 5 bowls, 1 goblet and 2 small lidded boxes. My last bowl was probably my best. I got a set of bowl gouges, learned to sharpen them and watched your video on riding the bevel and tried to apply that to my bowl. It was an improvement over my first few bowls. I really noticed the difference. Thanks for the videos and keep up the good work.

[kimr]

I agree with you on the finish of the scraper vs the gouge, but have to disagree a bit on cost comparisons. I know lots of turners, and none have a single gouge for turning. There are spindle gouges, and parting tools, and bottom gouges, etc.etc. As you said, the sharpening station is a big initial investment. I've been shopping for both types of tools, and haven't found those really expensive carbides yet. One on one, the two types are similar for quality tools. But as I said, all the turners I know have a box of gouges of various angles and grinds. I am just starting (bought a used midi), and trying to justify which way to spend to get turning. From what I've learned so far, even though traditional does a better job on the surface, it is way more expensive as an overall investment. Thanks for all you do, and I always get so much good information, and learn so much from your videos.

[davidgrant]

I like to use carbide tools for rough turning then traditional tools for finishing. Also I have a carbide tool that has a cupped tip that actually cuts rather than scraping. But it was an expensive tool and it has a very long reach. Love your videos and they are very helpful with turning bowls.

[larrystanley]

Really enjoy your videos. You seem to have the natural ability to explain what you are talking about!!!! I've learned a Lot from your videos. Now I have to learn how to turn correctly. Lol. Thank you so 👍👍👍👍👍

[jackthompson]

Kent. I use both carbide and bowl gouges when I make a bowl. I can get a pretty smooth cut with a carbide when I put it on edge and do a sheer cut. Thanks for the educational videos.

[billrobinson]

Lots to think about. I have the carbide and they're relatively easy to use. The gouges i got with the used lathe don't seem to be at the right angle, except for the 1" one. I'm going to build a sharpening station tomorrow. If it doesn't work, I'll have to spend the big bucks.
Thanks for all you do. You're the best

[POVMTB]

Getting into wood working you're not only learning how to build stuff, you're also learning how to sharpen your stuff, how to maintain all sort of tools, is just the deeper you go in the forest the more trees

[Heliumcraft]

It’s a great video. I just want to add that, if you own a set of traditional tools and sharpening system, it can be very cheap to make the carbide tool set with mild steel bar or even aluminum bar. you can turn handles with different length of handles and can replace most of scraping tools.

[stevecampbell]

I’m fairly new to turning bowls (I’ve produced 4). I have found your videos to be, by far, the most helpful and well produced out there. I’ve mostly used a bowl gouge but I still struggle a bit getting rid of ridges on the interior of the bowl. A recently purchased round nosed carbide tool helps me produce a better end result until I get more proficient with the gouge. Thank you for this balanced and useful video.

[unruly]

Good video, last summer I started turning for the first time. I ordered carbide tools and a mini lathe. The tools came in a week and the lathe took almost 2 months...lol The day the lathe arrived, around noon, I set it up in my shop and put a piece of wood in it around 2 pm. At dinner time that evening I set my first lidded bowl on the dinner table. That is the advantage of carbide. Almost no learning curve. There is absolutely no way that would have happened with hhs tools.

[bullfrogpondshop]

Thanks for an informative video!

I've used HSS my whole "career" (31 year shop teacher), but recently bought my first carbide tool. WOW! I'm turning ravioli pins in endgrain maple and this thing is sending ribbons of wood off the tool! I just mic'd one at .005" thick. The surface is smoother than anything I've ever gotten with HSS, although I will admit I'm only an intermediate level turner and I have no idea what "riding the bevel" means.

Yes, the carbide tools are more expensive than HSS, but a good sharpening system will cost several times more than carbide tools, not to mention the learning curve for the sharpening system itself on top of that.

I'll be investing in more carbide tools in the future, but no plans to completely abandon my HSS tools either.

[JDDupuy]

I have both types on 2 different Lathes in the workshop. I have my preferences depending on what I am doing. One type won't replace the other in my shop. And I don't draw a line in the sand over who uses what. Two ways to get down the same road. You did a nice job on the video.

[rickschuman]

I knew of 2 world class turners. One of them used conventional turning tools to roughy get to the shape of what he intended and at that point used sand paper to finish, beginning with 36 grit and using finer grits until a satisfactory surface was had. The other scraped every thing, using some car bide for thr roughing in and whatever sort of scraper got the best results. There is no better than. There is what ever technique and tools gets the work done.