What Comes After Globalization? | Foreign Affairs Interview Podcast

Foreign Affairs invites you to listen to its podcast, the Foreign Affairs Interview. This episode with Rana Foroohar was originally published on December 29, 2022.

In recent years, many of the key assumptions and ideas that guided economic policy for decades have fallen apart. Globalization pushed jobs overseas—and when those jobs were not replaced, the dislocation people felt gave rise to new political movements in the United States and beyond. Then the COVID-19 pandemic hit, and it laid bare how vulnerable global supply chains had become. While it is clear that the old system of neoliberal economic thinking is no longer working, it is far from certain what new ideas will replace the old paradigms.

Rana Foroohar is a business columnist and an associate editor at the Financial Times. She has covered trade and economic policy for years, and in an essay for Foreign Affairs—and a new book, titled Homecoming—she steps back to explain what went wrong and how the fallout is shaping global politics today.

We discuss the failure of neoliberal policies, the importance of manufacturing, and the recent crypto collapse.

SOURCES FOR THIS EPISODE
“After Neoliberalism” by Rana Foroohar

“How the System Was Rigged” by Branko Milanovic

“Fighting Climate Change Through Trade” by Joseph E. Stiglitz, Todd N. Tucker, and Isabel Estevez

“Can Trade Work for Workers?” by Gordon H. Hanson

“Globalization’s Wrong Turn” by Dani Rodrik

“The End of Globalization?” by Adam S. Posen

“The New China Shock” by Margaret M. Pearson, Meg Rithmire, and Kellee S. Tsai

[markb]

This woman has nailed it! The future cannot be based on wire transfers of imaginary numbers. Making things and figuring out better ways to make better things is the only way forward. Some CEO that doesn't know how to do anything practical doesn't deserve to make 100s of times more than someone that can make useful things.

[amorosogombe]

The real problem with neo liberal free market economics is that it isn't actually practiced. We say free markets are the best but when it comes to free movement of labour racist immigration laws block it. We say free global trade but when it comes to poor country agricultural goods going into rich countries markets they're blocked by tarriffs & subsidies. So we don't really have global free trade. We have selective global free trade.

[seankelly]

Can’t believe this interview doesn’t have more views

[andyreznick]

Truly insightful. Thanks for having Ms. Foroohar on.

[bunyip]

What about all the people in developed countries that neo liberalism hurled back into poverty as jobs were offshored to un/underdeveloped countries? There was no net gain in poverty reduction globally. Talk to people in the impoverished rust belts of the west.

[drewastolfi]

Man. I really liked this piece. Made sense of growing up in the 80s...when I got downsized at the factory I thought Id work at forever.

[taconobaka]

I don't think Rana appreciates the nuances of how a UBI empower people on a fundamental level. In fact, her comment on it, that "work matters" supports my view of why it would be a critical step forward. She's mired in the prevailing view that people must be forced to work with by the threat of starvation and homelessness. Will there be people that are content to just accept a free ride and not feel the need to work? Absolutely. However, for what I bet are a majority of people, a UBI would free them of the constraints of being forced to work at a dead end job that they hate just to put food on the table and a roof over their heads. It would free them to pursue their passions, be trained in a career field that they enjoy, which I believe would enhance innovation and lead to happier, more productive workers. I also think a UBI would lead to an explosion of cottage industries. At the same time, it would reduce labor costs for businesses. Granted, depending on how a UBI is funded labor cost reduction might be a wash, especially with the power a UBI would give labor. As far as people just not wanting to work, I think ambition and the drive to live better would be more than enough motivation for more people than not. It'll just free people to work for themselves or at least to pursue career paths they enjoy.

As far as I can tell, the promise to the working class made by Neo-liberalism was always at best, a fantasy, at worst, an outright lie. Wealth rises; it doesn't trickle down.

[patrickevans]

Excellent insight into how and why we need to change.

[baker]

very good discussion. I would add to Rana's thesis that it is income imbalances (both foreign - current accounts and domestic - labor vs capital) that must change. these imbalances have allowed the wall st shadow banking system to place the capital savings glut (savings is income not spent) and that is why interest rates have fallen for 40 years not the Fed who is only reactionary. this requires institutional changes. it's baked in the cake.

[davidbrunsdon]

Absolutely fantastic and thought provoking.

[JacobJonker-xufs]

There’s something that travels ever faster than capital. It’s covert cooperation and planning.

[JacobJonker-xufs]

Wage deflation is unevenly distributed. For many it is way more than the grossly dishonest official figure.

[lmvcnn]

Her solution is local manufactured $ 5600 bicycle instead of $560 imported from Taiwan that makes life meaningful?

[joshuap]

um young people were heavily invested in crypto because they thought they could make a fast buck, end of story. if older people stayed clear its because they are more risk averse.

[snowbirdsurfer]

“Trump is right on trade and China but he doesn’t share my social norms so I don’t like him.”