Ashenden-Scripted #4 'Say 'NO' to the Queering of Carols'

Ashenden-Scripted #4 "Say 'NO' to the Queering of Carols"

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[jameswall]

Thank you Fr Gavin. Your wise words mean a lot.

[joycepomfret]

Gavin, you are a gift to the Roman Catholic Church and to us. Thank you for sharing your faith and thoughts. Thank you for being so dedicated. I simply love the discussions with Mark Lambert and Katherine Bennett.

[kaylenehousego]

May His Spirit lead you ever on in His truth, as you seek to lead us.
Thank you and God bless you Gavin.

[boomerreb]

God bless you, sir. Merry Christmas!

[dorotheaivanovna]

Beautifully stated, as always. Sage, sound, succinct and sane. Helping to keep the feet of weary pilgrims on the path to everlasting life in Christ. There are many crucial missions in these darkening days but none more important than the one with which you have been entrusted.

[ML-uklu]

"Vertuous ingnorance" is all I can say. The church has fallen, they do not speak out. May God Have Mercy on Us.

[IrmgardWiesner]

Happy Christmas you also. At the Christmas you were accepted by the Church, my way to the Church started. Thank you!

[Basaljet]

Hope you are good and sending greetings for Christmas

[christopherquinn]

Thank you Dr Ashenden. BTW I suggest you compare the loudness of your videos compared with others on YouTube, as I think yours a bit quiet (or at least they are for me).

[ingridlinbohm]

Please turn your volume level up. Thanks. Happy Christmas.

[K-bqlv]

Just came across this. The twisting of the lyrics to a sacrilegious theme, sounds like a modern day version of what the goliards did many centuries back. Base human instincts never change, and the first targets of abuse are always religion and religious moral people and breaking down moral social order in society.

[Taft]

In between yourself and Father Calvin Robinson, there may yet be hope for British Christianity. God save the King. God save us all.

[michelleferguson]

Thank you, very thought provoking. True in theory. But...

In practice, has not the Spirit of humble, obedient perfect love turned towards God (and out to others) often taken a backseat in the Church ?

The Keys of the Kingdom are like Tolkien's rings.
Power is problematic.

If plaques in Churches commemorate young men who died in battle against political enemies, why are there no plaques to commemorate the young women who died in childbirth.?
Simple question.
Why not ?
Is their pain not gruesome enough?
Are their lives not as valuable?
Is the neverending battle they are engaged in not of sufficient heavenly worth?

Is it anything to do with men holding keys of the Kingdom and wearing rings of power?

I think so. I don't think we should rush out and install plaques for warrior women. I dare not suggest that the plaques for men should be taken down.... for those young soldiers all had mothers who risked their own lives to bring them into the world and see their son's sacrifice as their own.
Catholics do have the solace of Marian spirituality.
I honour our Mother Mary, and estimate her loving intercession as worth more than all the commemorative wall plaques in the world.

But... the extreme feminists of today who change words of traditional Carol's are running on a battery of hurt and anger that is charged and recharged continually ( like a hybrid electric motor) by the very real disregard of men in positions of power.

What we need, on all sides, is less anger, more soul searching (on every side) and more Colossians 3.

[rebeccanichol]

If you haven't seen it already, you'll love the latest video on the C of E YouTube channel, "Living in Love and Faith: College of Bishops Residential II". I don't know why they're bothering having conversations as the outcome will have been determined already. Also, there seems to be only one expression of love that merits discussion and one which often doesn't express love at all, rather something else.

[neillrobb]

Where is the Archbishop of silent when the Gospel is attacked!!!

[aidankiely]

Quite apart from anything else, I find this constant bombardment of affirming messaging so boring! They don’t even help the minority groups they claim to help: they just demean and patronise, not advocating treating people equally and fairly, but elevating certain groups to a special, sanctified status, earned simply by being who they are, not by being beloved children of God. Insanity! Happy Christmas though.

[veronica_._._._]

Ha! On fire!

Also, "woman" "Vicar"🙄 a poor substitute, for a legitimate substitute.

[diannalaubenberg]

Name of the hymnal/songbook? We'll be looking at new hymnals soon, and I want to avoid this one!

[livetwice]

Luciferian in origin, that is the only conclusion you can draw from it …

[robgee]

I watched this in its entirety hoping for a rational piece of commentary that followed the norms of professional academic discourse governed by high-quality evidence and reasoned critique of counterargument.

Alas.

Must we be doomed to listen to pundits of modest ability repeat ageing arguments to their own echo chamber audiences? Is there no better defence of tradition than this?

Four specific requests from me:

1. “Assault on Christian lyrics”. What evidence is there for this being an assault on Christian lyrics? The original lyrics are not scripture, but a seemingly seventeenth-century composition of anonymous authorship. The original lyrics are also somewhat unlike the version commonly sung today and have been revised at numerous points in recent centuries. This latest revision is major, yes, but by an ordained practitioner of a mainstream Christian denomination. Is it not then a Christian lyric, by definition? And what specific version is being assaulted, of the various and varied historical versions of the text previously available? Why an “assault”, specifically? What evidence is there that this was intended as anything other than a one-off bit of textual licence? This needs to be explained better in the video.

2. The references to Jungian archetypes should be referenced (which publication might these be found in and where does that publication sit in the chronology of Jung’s output?) Why Jung, specifically? What do other, more modern, thinkers make of the same issue? What is the reception history around these ideas from Jung and are they generally accepted and applied in professional fields today? At present this feels like somewhat spurious knowledge-signalling, generally found when a student has read only one of the books on my reading lists!

3. Can the relationship between Christian doctrine and ‘woke’ ideology, specifically in relation to ideas around power redistribution, be more carefully explained and, again, with broader and deeper academic cross-referencing? Many viewers might be inclined to scratch their heads at the suggestion Christian doctrine has nothing to do with power redistribution in its non-woke form.

4. The natural and most obvious rebuttal to this commentary (and I’m surprised nobody has yet made it, but then I did suggest we were working in an echo chamber above) is that a message of love and inclusivity is surely preferable to a touristic, passively-consumed rendition of this carol as in so many services across the globe this past month. Why is the faith better served by this piece of disapproving commentary instead? And, on that point, what effort might commentators such as this be expected to make to avoid their well-intentioned criticism acting as kindling to the somewhat less well-intentioned reactions we have seen to this topic on social media? Without these considerations, how can such commentary be expected to persuade? Or, cynical of me perhaps, is its purpose solely to soothe the minds of those already convinced and, in so doing, generate some revenue for the author in his echo chamber?

This Christmas, I pray for higher quality debate and higher quality commentary on these important social issues.