351 Cleveland 400 or 351M Which Is It?

When Buying a Facebook Marketplace 351 It is good to know what you are getting. This guide to the 351 Cleveland 351 M and 400 Ford V8 will make it easier to know what you are looking at. Also is it 351 M 351 Modified, or 351 Michigan? We dive into that as well.

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Episode 272 Manic Mechainc

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[badcamaro]

That is a double spring with dampener. One good thing the 400 crank was good for. Back in the early 90`s I worked for Chris Huff of Probe had a small machine shop in the San Fernando valley. I learned how to cut the 400 crank to fit the Windsor block. Also did cranks for CDW and a few other shops in the area. But man the 400 crank was a lot of work. It was nothing compared to modern cranks but back then it was the most affordable way to stroke a Windsor

[MrPoppyDuck]

Wow 50 bucks for a pair of 4 bbl 351c closed chamber heads? That is basically free! Nice score!

[johnbehneman]

THANK YOU SO MUCH. I AM STILL LEARNING ABOUT FORD MOTORS. I LEARNED A LOT. PLEASE CONTINUE TO SHARE YOUR TRUTH.

[jonathancross-jmyu]

Hi Phil great information on the difference between these blocks. If the block is not cracked or over bored, ( no more than .020”) Just sleeve that #5 hole and bore it to .030” it’ll be fine..plus you get to keep the matching numbers block!!
We don’t have the problem here in Australia with regard to Cleveland differences as we only had the 302c or 351c based engines. Exactly same blocks just different cranks and rods.
Bolt patterns on the rears were identical and both were available to suit Top loaders, Single Rail 4 spd, C4, & FMX Transmissions..super simple down under!!

[kennethcohagen]

When you plug the exhaust heat crossovers on a Mopar 440 you gain 20+ hp. Even though the Cleveland is cold blooded it would help in racing, and in the Desert Southwest it rarely gets cold enough to be a problem.

[mycontinental]

Jeff I also seen them being called 351 Midland 400. Great info. Back in my machine shop days I used charge $100.00 per sleave.

[HeathKopp]

Double valve springs with a dampener spring there Jeff...

[kaosactual]

Although sometimes called the "Windsor" by enthusiasts, Ford never used that designation for the engine line as a whole; it was only adopted well into its run to distinguish the 351 cu in (5.8 L) version from the 351 cu in (5.8 L) "Cleveland" version of the 335-family engine that had the same displacement but a significantly different configuration, and only ever used to refer to that specific engine in service materials. The designations for each were derived from the original locations of manufacture: Windsor, Ontario and Cleveland, Ohio.

[OlysGarage]

Can't say I've heard them called Michigans, but definitely Modifieds or Midlands. The story as I've heard it was the 351M got the 'modified' designation because it was a "modified" 400.
Also, for some strange reason in either 71 or '73, there were 400s made with dual bell housing bold patterns, both BBF and SBF.

[robertclymer]

Hi Jeff, excellent information on these blocks. Good to know when searching for one and not get one that is not what is really is. Cheers from Motown!

[patrickmcgoldrick]

The quickest way is small block pattern, 289-351 Windsor is Cleveland, the 370-460 Bell housing pattern is the 351-400 M, plus the heads are wider apart.

[darronmecak]

Just for your information in 1973 some 400 blocks had the smallblock bellhousing cast into them they are called the fmx400 and are very rare there is a few pictures of them on the internet, some also have the provison for normal cleveland or windsor engine mount bosses which are not drilled but also feature the normal 3 bolt engine mount, ford was scared they were going to run out of 351c engines for the pantera in 1974 so they cast the 400 block with the normal 351c mount bosses, but never used them, also not all 400/351m blocks have the rib cast in the top near the china rail, i have a CF foundry block with no rib.

[kenfritsch]

One easy way to tell the difference between the 445 and the Cleveland is bell housing the 351 V has small block bell housing pattern whereas the 361/400 345 series has the same bell housing as a 429/460

[dooroldford]

Even though 400 isn't "m" to find parts it is best to use 400m as if you just use 400 you will get gm stuff mostly, however typing 400m, will bring up correct ford stuff instantly

[durango.]

I knew the bell housings were different, but I never knew about the Chinese wall thankyou.

[operationoverloard]

Thanks for the tidbit of front-of-block differences. That's the 1 I did not know.
The main bore diameters are also different in size between the Cleveland (at 2 ¾") and the 351M/400 (at 3")...provided that view is available.
Thanks a bunch. You know the differences and histories and know how to explain it all.

[opprometheus]

I remember my dad purchased a 1971 Ford LTD that had the 400. It had plenty of low end torque. There are some YT vids of guys that actually built them as performance engines.

[misters]

The C vs M thing will drive you nuts...But what is worse...is when someone calls a 1976 351W a "351c" either they don't know better OR they think its gonna get premium money... Jay Leno called the 351 in Jeff Dunham's 1976 Econoline a 351C... Its not for obvious reasons.

[aguyinnc]

Some guys can just find all the goodies. Super buy on those heads! So, I just ran out and checked under the hood of my '73 Mach 1, and yes it is a Cleveland. Something that always puzzled me though, it looks like it has a C6 trans. No removable bell housing, no cast iron case. I had a '73 Gran Torino Sport back in the day that had the FMX trans. Always thought of the C6 being used for heavy duty applications. Obviously, my 351C 2V will never strain that C6 unless I start doing engine mods. Had wondered if it was actually a 351M or 400 somebody before me had swapped in. But you answered that question! Still wanting to pull the engine and make some changes, but the piggy bank ain't full yet! Btw if you run across another set of those heads....😁

[chrisrye]

Race prepped CC heads for only $50?! Stole 'em! Nice find!