Finishing Up John Lennox and John 6 & 12

We got back to John Lennox’s book, Determined to Believe and its attempt to deal with John 6. We spent most of our time here, as it is invaluable to see how tradition can impact and, in a few places, completely overthrow the direct content of the text itself.

[reformedcatholic]

I'd like to see my Synergist friends to explain how the texts that teach predestination forsees faith, how they come to that conclusion. Predestination means in Greek "marked out before hand" no forseen faith, just God's monergistic act to save.

[DesireeDierdre]

Excellent teacher! It is true we can hang on to previous traditions. The beauty of Calvinistic teaching is that GOD is the author and finisher of Faith then there is absolutely hope for the one who has been taught you can get salvation and then lose it. Not if GOD is the author and finisher of Faith!

[thediamondcreeper]

John Lennox also believes in the Genesis 'Gap Theory' i.e there are potentially billions of years of time between Genesis 1:1 and 1:3. He does this to accomodate his preconcieved notion of the creation account. If you're already wrong on Genesis 1 then you're going to have interpretation problems through to Revelation 22. Hey James - Please do a exegetical video on Genesis 1!

[osks]

In Romans 10, Paul gives a proper response to people like John Lennox, Leighton Flowers, William Lane Craig, Frank Turek and the rest of them who are so wedded to their Autonomian commitments, that, in the words of Paul, while “they are zealous for God, THEIR ZEAL IS NOT BASED ON KNOWLEDGE… since they did not know the righteousness of God and SOUGHT TO ESTABLISH THEIR OWN, they did not submit to God's righteousness” - Rom 10:2, 3

[JohnMackeyIII]

Hold up and wait, just a second. What if verse 44 comes before verse 45.

[spacemanspliff]

So what does it mean to be a believer then? You agree that Jesus died? If the theology doesn’t form a basis to conclude whether someone is a believer or not, then why even do this?

If Lennox is a gospel believer, which White believes he is since he says that he can consider him a brother, what is the thing that Lennox believes about Christ that makes White consider him a believer?

If the gospel is just that Jesus died and rose again, then why bother with this conversation. It literally doesn’t matter, since apparently Lennox is a Christian even where He denies that Christ came to accomplish the Father’s will.

So pray tell, how can one be a believer who does not believe what God says about what He accomplished and who He did it for? What is the gospel James?

[paullaymon]

This is what happens when you sanitize the New Testament from the back drop of second temple Judaism. White is right in the rendering of the text. He is wrong to who he is applying it to. Jesus is speaking to the Jews. They are in a unique position. Jews in the inter testament time frame could have a relationship with the Father through the prophets and the scriptures prior to a relationship with the Son. As a matter of fact this was the only reason that they could come to the Son. Those that knew the Father were compelled by the Father to come to the Son. They listened and learned from the Father and accepted the Son.
“It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.”

The unbelieving Jew made the claim that their Father was God yet they denied the Son. Jesus knew that they were unbelievers because if God was their father; believing in the Son was irresistible.

There is no unconditional election articulated in John 6:44-45.
The Jews first had to believe in the Father to be drawn to the Son.