Atheist Debates - How did Judas die?

Is there a contradiction in the accounts of how Judas died? Who was he? Is there a way to resolve this?

[drlegendre]

I picked up on the issues surrounding the utter necessity of Judas' "betrayal" of Jesus very early on. In fact, I voiced my concerns to our Sunday school leader when I must have been 8-9 years old.

His reply was that yes, I was basically correct - but regardless of God's plans, what Judas did was still evil, unforgivable and deserving of God's judgment.

As you can imagine, this didn't sit well with me.

[tzuqbts]

As a child growing up, it never occured to me to question what I was being taught by my parents and in church. So many questions arise now that I have a fully developed adult brain. You don't even need contradictions.

Who wrote Jeremiah and how do you know what year the book was written?
How do you know Jeremiah wrote Jeremiah? If my name is John, what prevents me writing a book named Jeremiah?
Why do you think the person who wrote this was inspired by god?
How does the author know that it was god that inspired them?
If a powerful voice echoes in your head to inspire you to write a book, how do you determine who the voice belongs to?
Are demons not capable of deceiving you? What if this entire book was written by people deceived by demons for the purpose of leading us away from the true god, Zeus?

It's all so ridiculous. I'm actually ashamed it took me so long to see it.

Thank you for all the work you've done. It was work by you and others like you that helped me escape the brainwashing.

[chrishocker]

Judas doesn’t have to “make sense” as a real person. He seems to me to have been simply constructed entirely as a literary villain. When Judas shows up in the story it’s the part where the audience is supposed to boo him.

When he questions the wisdom of pouring expensive perfume on Jesus, he isn’t allowed to be even a little bit correct the way human beings who aren’t tropes are. Not only does he get reprimanded by Jesus, we get the added aside that no, actually, Judas was a thief and just wanted to steal the money they could have saved.

[s_bushido]

The vilification of Judas is strange. But only because we're **supposed** to believe this was planned all along. Once again, the omni- qualities they want to assign to their god get in the way of a story that actually makes sense...

[dorianxanyn]

Matt I'm not sure if you read these but I hope you do. The past year or so I've started watching atheist debates and came across you in the atheist experience, the line and talk heathen. I want to thank you. I believe that watching you break apart logical fallacies drastically helped me raise my LSAT score by at least 20 points. Thank you

[while.coyote]

it's funny they're using Zechariah, because Zechariah is so obviously where a lot of the Jesus mythos was directly stolen from. It was written 500 years before Jesus, yet it's a story about an actual historical guy named Jesus, with a father named Joseph, who became the first high priest of the new temple and was taken up to heaven and given a white robe and golden crown by the angels and called the "new branch" of Judaism by God. Wow, how coincidental that this actual historical guy named Jesus who started the temple is so similar to this other guy named Jesus who ended the temple.

[michaelcamp]

Even if a story has zero contradictions, that has no bearing on whether or not it's true. Christians will tie themselves in knots trying to iron out the inconsistencies in these conflicting stories, but this is a red herring.

[airpower]

I don't debate any contradictions or anything in the Bible until they can show demonstrable evidence that any of it's true

[rebecca-borg]

Wow, 3 videos in 2 days! Matt you're spoling us.

[pilgrimpater]

The contradiction is not so much how Judas died but the fact he was not forgiven and received God's wrath despite Jesus dying for his sin as is supposed to happen according to Christians.

[oscargordon]

As someone who seriously doubts that the Jesus stories are based on an actual person and not just manufactured from the Old Testament stories "whole cloth", the best explanation is that these are just "fan fiction". People hearing the Jesus story asked "So what happened to Judas?" Two different story tellers came up with different fates for Judas. And since the Bible editors were just to lazy to pick one, they decided to included two mutually contradictory stories just like they did for Jesus' origin story, .

[davidofoakland]

Judas' death IS a contradiction. The claim in Matthew is that Judas died when he hung himself; the claim in Acts states that he died when his guts burst forth when he fell "headlong". Combining the two stories into one narrative (hung first, fell later) doesn't resolve this contradiction, for if Judas died by hanging, then Acts is wrong because Judas died by hanging (and then his dead body fell); if Judas died when he fell, the Mathew is wrong because Judas died by bursting, not by hanging, because Judas was very much alive when the rope broke and his guts burst forth.

[JesusSkateboardsdotnet]

A Place to Bury Strangers is actually a band, their snappiest number is "exploding head " 🎶

[paulavery]

Matt is right about that because there's a number of reasons it might have contradictions. For example a great deal of it's original texts have been removed and of course interpretation. But the Judas thing is a flat out contradiction. But you rarely hear Christians talk about the disemboweling death and just stick to the suicide narrative.

[paulavery]

I asked my Christian friend why it says Satan entered Judas if it was part of God's plan. The best thing he could tell me was the devil just didn't want to deal with him so he "sent him back to heaven" 🤦

[Thundawich]

I know this isn't the focus of the video, but I actually find judas to be one of the most compelling characters in the bible AND one of the characters whose representation within the bible shows how the stories relating to Jesus were changing over time. He goes from a principled disciple that gives up his friend because of a specific moral failing that he perceives, to a serial thief that only hangs around Jesus to increase personal wealth.

[artmoss]

I appreciate those comments about how illogical it is for Judas to have to identify Jesus. For years, I've been puzzled by that necessity, but thought I was alone in my questioning.

[cupofcoffee]

I think Matthew 19:28 ist quite remarkable in this context: "Jesus said to them, “Truly I tell you, at the renewal of all things, when the Son of Man sits on his glorious throne, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel."
Jesus is clearly talking about his twelve disciples sitting on twelve thrones, which must include Judas. Was Jesus deceiving everyone here or did he actually not know Judas would betray him? Or is Judas supposed to sit on a throne anyway?

[Raz.C]

I couldn't find any YouTube clips for it, but there's an AWESOME Red Dwarf episode (Season 10, Episode 3 - Lemons) where Rimmer explains the precepts of the Church of Judas that his parents were part of. The episode is one of the best Red Dwarf episodes yet made (I've heard that they might be making even more, even after the 'recent' movie that was kinda meant as a farewell) and I HIGHLY recommend it to anyone who enjoys British comedies. If you don't know what Red Dwarf is, then you're in for a real treat!! I wish I could erase it from my memory, so that I could go back and watch the entire series from the beginning, all over again, for the first time!!!

[SilortheBlade]

I laugh every time I hear an apologist try to rectify the different deaths of Judas. As if Judas was some sort of rube goldberg device. Judas has always seemed like a literary construct to me.