it's okay to love bad people.

why do we love bad people even when we know they're bad?

THIS IS NOT ADVICE TO GET BACK WITH YOUR TOXIC EX!
we can often feel like people who do us wrong do not deserve our love. but sometimes, we end up in situations where we can't help but love someone who is bad for us. why does this happen? can we separate the attitude of love from the actions we take? how should we think of the concept of "bad" people?

✧･ﾟ: *✧･ﾟ:* i'd love to hear what you all have to say *:･ﾟ✧*:･ﾟ✧

TIMESTAMPS:
00:00 intro
1:58 psychoanalysis
6:13 love as a mental attitude
13:24 equal vs. unequal relationships
15:15 love as action
17:39 what does "bad" mean in our non-ideal world?
21:01 therapy speak

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socials:
,, instagram: @olisunvia
,, spotify: liv sun
,, depop: @ol1sunv1a

FOR BUSINESS INQUIRIES:
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SOURCES:
bell hooks. 1999. All About Love.
Contreras, Cydney. "Where Are Jeffrey Dahmer's Parents Now?" December 6, 2023.
Elder, Alexis. "Why Bad People Can't Be Good Friends." July 4, 2013.
Han, Yongming. "Do We Love For Reasons?" August 27, 2019.
Mason, Cathy. "What’s Bad about Friendship with Bad People?" March 8, 2022.
Murdoch, Iris. 1997. Existentialists and Mystics: Writings on Philosophy and Literature.
Schwindt, Oriana. "The Luxury of Loving Bad Men." August 15, 2018.
Setiya, Kieran. “Love and the Value of a Life.” July 1, 2014.
Souerbry, Rachel. "What Parents Of Serial Killers Have Said About Their Offspring." September 26, 2022.
Velleman, David J. “Beyond Price.” 2008.
Warren, Tom, & Dahir, Ikran. "The Untold Story Of Andrew Tate, The Internet’s Most Notorious Influencer." March 9, 2023.

MUSIC:
Alexander Ilyinsky — Lullaby, Op. 13, No. 7
Oskar Merikanto -- Valse lente, Op. 33
Gennady Lukinykh -- 21 Miniatures

tags: love, our conception of love is messed up, loving bad people, toxic relationships, red flags, abusive relationship, abusive toxic partner, therapy speak, therapy language, toxic gf, toxic bf, manipulative, delusional, bpd, relationship advice, bojack horseman, the bear, fishes, all about love, bell hooks, baby reindeer, break up, structural inequalities, 4B movement, self-care, self-help, social media, feminism, feminist, patriarchy, oppression, feminist philosophy, gender norms, misogyny, social commentary, neoliberal feminism, internet analysis, video essay, analysis video, philosophy, tiktok, shanspeare, jordan theresa, vox, vice, cj the x, tiffany ferg, alice cappelle, contrapoints, philosophy tube, madisyn brown, chad chad, sisyphus 55, tara mooknee

[Milk_Man_]

“The purpose of video essays is to kickstart your thinking, not complete it”

Bars fr.

[marksilla]

your therapist when your card declines:

[Mahawww]

Wanting the best for someone and trying to help them get better is never wrong.

Letting someone get away with doing bad things with no accountability and continuing to support them as if nothing happened because you "love" them is just you allowing them to hurt you and/or other people and that is wrong.

[lynnpham]

wake up babe olivia came back from europe vacay and dropped a new video

[opossumboyo]

One traditional aspect of relationships I fear we are losing in the modern world is loyalty for the purpose of growth. “Red flag” dating culture encourages identifying traits that are negative as soon as possible in a potential partner, and usually conflates those traits as impossible to overcome. That does not allow either member of the relationship to grow.

Excited to listen to this one later today. You make excellent content and deserve all of the following you’ve achieved and more.

[millie]

My sister stopped talking to me because "sometimes" I'm rude. So all of my good qualities weren't enough reason for her to love me, and she used therapy talk on me. But she was downright mean to me (she's 8 years older than me btw) SOOO many times, and my response was to forgive and forget. "Throwing people away" just because they aren't perfect is becoming very common. I think it's okay to cut contact with toxic people, but expecting someone to be perfect at all times is actually toxic as well.

[xavierrockz]

"To feel sane, I must forego love; to feel love, I must render myself insane" damn that was brutal😭

[yuli]

Maybe a bit off-topic, but as someone who ended an abusive relationship with one of my parents (death threats, abuse), I oftentimes struggle to talk about it whenever the question of "why have you fallen out with your parent" arrises.

Usually, when explaining the whole situation, the people who fail to understand me can be divided into two types. One type tries to justify every act of abuse on my parent's behalf I mention regardless of how bad it is. In their opinion, I have failed as a child to forgive my parent, to see the inherent value of love between a parent and a child, and to somehow salvage our relationship (even though I feel like I have tried everything else but cut them off of my life). The other type argues with me whenever I mention the positives of our parent-child relationship and what I love and appreciate about my abuser as a person. They see it as irrational defence of the abuse and as me failing to see my parent's evilness in its entirety.

In both cases, what I tell these people is how that, although I love my parent for everything good they've done to me and appreciate their positive qualities, I do not excuse their behavior whenever I think they went too far. In my view, the first group support an unhealthy version of the "love as an attitude" theory, while the second group leans too hard on the "love as an action" theory.

EDIT: For me personally, ideal love is a balance between the two approaches. If love is only an attitude, you're gonna see everyone as having some inherent value that must always be appreciated no matter what. Consequently, you become too allowing of others' bad behavior and will always try to save relationships that are falling apart beyond repair. But if love is only an action, you're gonna see everyone as having to prove their worth to you and if they fail even once, you leave them forever. As a result, you become too selective and unforgiving of others, whilst failing to see any ways the other person can plausibly change themselves for the better.

[boo]

"The only time I feel good is when I find the evil parts of other people. It makes me feel less alone." Really resonated with me. I feel much more comfortable with people who show me their evil.

[FabianEllis]

I agree, as a society I think we need to love each other & stand up for marginalised voices more. This doesn’t mean standing up for bad people, it means showing bad people how to love & be good people.

[parmishin]

“the purpose of video essays like this are to kickstart your thinking, not to complete it.” well said, Olivia. and i think it applies to any type of media or source of information–not just video essays–which people fail to remember.

[henrybig]

The part about BPD hit really hard. I hate how this world can be so cut throat, you come across the wrong way, make one mistake, you get to be gatekept and shunned. It happened routinely to one of my exes who I believe had bpd. It broke my heart as I tried to be an exeption to that out of loving intentions l. The reality was that she would constantly sabotage her life and that out relationship never felt safe so could never go deeper. And to have to be another one of the people who eventually steps away from her, and for her to end being the “bad person” of the story has been devastating for me too. It s like you can’t win, sometimes even Love can’t win. Or stepping away was actually the most respectful or Loving thing to do? I have no peace for that. When I think of people being labeled as bad, I think of the nuances of her personality and in general of such experience. Thanks for the video!

[clea]

I think that there is a difference between simply loving someone and letting someone hurt you over and over again because you love them. You can love someone while letting them go and holding onto your self respect. There have been people in my life who I really did cherish and who will always have a special place in my heart, but that I had to distance myself from, simply because I could not agree with their current behaviour anymore and because I realized that it is not my responsibility to wait for them to grow. I agree that it is okay to love bad people, because we cannot control what our heart desires, but you still have to look out who gets to stay in your life and whose and what actions you support through your love.

[cami_triz]

This means so much. Ive been feeling like an awful person for being involved with extremely selfish and unempathetic people with horrible beliefs. I felt terrible about myself because no matter how awful they and their beliefs were, I struggled a lot to walk away because of everything I knew they were going through.

I always made sure to hold them accountable and always voiced my disagreements, but the more I stayed the more my mental health declined, so I ended up finally walking away. As someone with very bad abandonment issues, that was an extremely conflicting experience. But this video feels like a hug

[jordicochegrus]

The therapy speak portion I think is the most relevant aspect, and it leads into a greater issue in society. People are hyperfixating on "becoming the best self" that we forgetting that part of becoming self-actualized is taking on a role that encourages growth in others. You can't care for others if it's an inconvenience for you - your needs are always more important than others needs. And eventually you become stunted, because how much can we really grow if we only allow ourselves that space in echo chambers that never challenge the path we've chosen? Sometimes, our obsession with self-growth comes at the cost of others. Sometimes that's a good thing, but it isn't right to act like your own comfort and desires should always trump the needs of others, particularly those we love.

[Dewpoke]

ive loved bad people and ive been a bad person who has been loved, and how complicated that feeling is that nothing i write on a single youtube comment can explain it all, but to me love comes already with the "bad" things. I can only draw the line at violent crime tbh.

[sporovid]

I think this debate is a classic example of conflating the map for the territory. “Love” is a word we’ve invented to describe how we feel, but words are not reality—they’re tools. I believe that we have to assess someone’s behavior on an individual basis (I love this way, you love that way). If love doesn’t have a concrete definition, it makes sense that some types of love cause pain while others don’t. In my opinion, a successful relationship is one where all parties act out their love in a similar or complimentary way.

[Salma-wzsd]

As someone with ADHD and memory issues due to trauma, I often forget birthdays and important dates, little things, and gifts from people but I still love my friends and believe I am deserving of love.
I express my love through art and random "I love you" texts, and my friends understand that even if I miss their official anniversaries, every day is their anniversary with me.
I think everyone is deserving of love, and believing in a uniform love is stupid because everyone loves differently, but we all love nonetheless

[footbriefcase]

10:32 is exactly what I think about love. You can still feel an emotional connection to a bad person, while disagreeing with their actions.

[loadishstone]

My favorite thing is how this comment section is full of people not willing to admit they are probably bad people by someone else’s standards. Egotism is strong.