“Jazz Theory” DEBUNKED- the truth by master Barry Harris

[luizcadu]

My teacher Gamela, who was also the master of some of the greatest brazilian guitarists like Lula Galvão and Nelson Faria, used to say: "stop that nonsense talk about modes, or I'll commit a HOMICIDIAN!" 😂

[deansaghafi]

Grand Master Harris is absolutely right! I studied with him for 5 years. He was a genius! Follow him and you'll learn how to play jazz right! Blessings

[simonanthonymcglynn]

I am Studying Barry Harris method of playing jazz at the moment.. it's brilliant and really makes sense.

[RavenYan]

Really wish we could’ve seen a conversation between Barry and Coltrane

[archlordXd]

modes aren't necessary for bebop, which is the style the Barry values. they help for other ideas/styles of playing. if you only want to play bebop, don't worry about them. if you are interested in multiple avenues within music and improvisation, modes are great and important.

[Yami-dk]

You can absolutely learn to play jazz without studying jazz theory, but jazz theory adds depth and clarity to your playing. Think of your jazz skills as a piece of land...learning theory is like building a fence around it. It helps you define, understand, and explain why certain things happen in jazz and how they work.

Jazz theory is essentially the science behind the music, giving you the tools to communicate and collaborate more effectively. It allows you to articulate your feelings, ideas, and emotions in a structured way, equipped with the vocabulary to express yourself clearly. This isn’t just true for jazz...it applies to any genre.

Quincy Jones himself emphasized the importance of musicians being well-versed in theory. While it's perfectly fine to create great music without it, theory provides incredible advantages. It helps you better understand your craft and empowers you to connect more deeply with other musicians and your audience.

[ironlion_zion]

In the common language of much jazz pedagogy, it has become customary to refer to the sequences of seven diatonic tones derived from each degree of the major (or minor) scale as “modes.”
Thus, people improperly speak of the “Dorian mode” on the II degree, the “Phrygian” on the III, the “Lydian” on the IV, and so on—creating inevitable confusion.

In reality, these sequences of seven notes starting from each degree, within a tonal context, are not modes, but simple heptachords: ordered segments of the scale, melodic substructures within a single modal structure (major or minor).

It is precisely this terminological overlap—calling “modes” what are actually heptachords—that creates the greatest misunderstanding in grasping tonality: the false idea that it is some sort of collage of separate modes, each corresponding to a scale degree.

But tonality, by definition, is a system based on a single functional mode (major or minor), with a tonic, a network of harmonic functions (tonic, dominant, subdominant, etc.), and a centripetal organization of relationships.
Triads, seventh chords, and heptachords are not independent modal entities, but coherent substructures of a higher structure: the tonal mode of reference, which in tonal theory is called the key.

To be clear: a mode is an autonomous musical structure, with its own tonic, characteristic cadences, and a distinct identity function.
A heptachord, by contrast, is a substructure, like a triad or a seventh chord: it contains seven diatonic notes, but is functionally dependent on the parent tonality.
Calling “Dorian mode” what is simply the II heptachord of the major scale means mistaking an internal fragment for a complete system, attributing structural dignity to something that has none in that context.

The confusion becomes evident with a simple question:
If the V degree (e.g., G in C major) is defined as such—the V of what?
Answer: of the major mode.
Calling it “Mixolydian mode” would imply that G is an autonomous tonic, with its own modal system—which is clearly false in a tonal context, where G functions solely as the dominant of the I degree.

One might object: “But when we tonicize the V, aren’t we treating it as a I degree?”
Certainly—but that’s another matter: tonicization is a functional mechanism within tonality, not a modal change.
When we tonicize the V, we are temporarily treating it as if it were the tonic of a major key, through its secondary dominant (V/V)—that is, we are still applying tonal logic.
If anything, this reinforces the idea that tonality is unitary, not made of autonomous modes.

I believe that using the correct terminology is not pedantry, but an act of conceptual clarity.
By properly speaking of:
• 7 triads,
• 7 seventh chords,
• 7 heptachords (seventh chord + 3 passing notes),
we describe the entire basic diatonic tonal vocabulary without resorting to inappropriate modal names, which belong instead to other historical systems (Gregorian chant, Renaissance modal counterpoint, Impressionism, modal jazz, archaic folk music).

Using mode names (Dorian, Phrygian, etc.) makes sense when talking about genuinely modal structures, with a modal finalis (i.e., tonic).

But to name as a structure (mode) what is only a substructure (heptachord) is a theoretical error that creates confusion, hinders learning, and distorts the understanding of the tonal system.
Instead, adopting the term heptachord, numbered consistently according to the degree it starts from (I, II, III, …, VII), offers at least three crucial pedagogical advantages:
1. Theoretical clarity: it avoids confusing tonality with modality;
2. Functional consistency: it associates each heptachord with its real harmonic function, in parallel with the related triads and seventh chords;
3. Simplified memorization: it spares the learner from having to arbitrarily remember that the “Phrygian mode” corresponds to the III degree, the “Lydian” to the IV, and so on—favoring instead an explicit and intuitive numerical logic, consistent with that of scale degree functions (II heptachord, V heptachord, etc.).

You might be wondering:
“If I’m in the key of C and a secondary dominant like D7 (V/V) appears?”
Great: just ask yourself what D7 is the dominant of [spoiler: G major]. You’re simply tonicizing the V (so play on G major scale V heptachord on D7 and, as soon as you get to G7, you know you’re back in C major and play the V heptachord of C major).

You might be wondering, part 2:
“If I’m in the key of C and a Bb7(#11) (bVII7) appears?”
Great: just ask yourself what Bb7(#11) is the IV of
[spoiler: F melodic minor].
In this case, it’s a “false dominant” with a plagal function (it’s as if you’re playing IVm6 with its 4 in the bass), so play on F melodic minor IV heptachord.

There is too much confusion today about how things work, and not just in
It’s the fault of a rampant relativism where the personal opinions of the latest newcomer seek to have the same value as what has been passed down to us through centuries by those who, lacking our technologies, had to keep their mind highly trained in active reasoning: for example, the Great Masters of the past did NOT learn “the chords”, BUT the voice-leading (or “voicing”) that generates the chords…
So, it’s not about being “conservative”, but about being logical and rational when discussing certain matters.
“Conservatism” might eventually be a consequence, but only in an era dominated by “subjective truths”…(any reference to this idiocracy era is purely coincidental)…

Even in harmony, there is a lot of confusion.
People often try to memorize chords one by one, from the simplest to the most complex, thinking only vertically, almost always without understanding the logic of voice leading that generates the chords from the scale and connects them to each other…

I recommend everyone to study counterpoint and figured bass from Baroque music to truly understand tonal harmony in four parts (bass with the left hand; tenor, alto, and soprano with the right hand), and how it actually works.
Study the harmonized scale in all keys according to the “rule of the octave, ” which shows all the tonal possibilities.
This for at least a year (ideally three years: first the foundation, then the walls).

Once you deeply understand classical tonal harmony, you’ll discover that
the so-called “jazz harmony” doesn’t exist.
Really, it doesn’t.
In classical harmony manuals, 9th, 11th, and 13th chords are already present: the only difference is that they also show how to handle them, which doesn’t happen in those ridiculous ‘jazz harmony’ booklets…
You will realize that there is no chord that hadn’t already been played before jazz even existed.
You will understand the difference between theoretical harmony, which deals with which notes are in a chord from an abstract perspective, starting from the root and stacking in thirds, and practical harmony, which focuses on how to distribute chord tones across four voices—for example, doubling a note in triads, omitting a note in ninth chords, and so on.
You will learn to play any chord, no matter how complex, using only four voices...
You will recognize the importance of voice leading (or voicing) to avoid parallel fifths and octaves, which merge voices and weaken polyphony (parallel octaves are allowed as reinforcement, especially for the bass an octave below when there’s no double bass, since you are still working with only four voices and not adding a fifth one).

Regarding Barry Harris, his system goes beyond diatonicism, incorporating chromatic techniques (Chopin) and superimposing the octatonic system (Stravinsky) onto the diatonic one.
This further approach enriches the harmonic and melodic vocabulary, blending tonality with more complex and non-diatonic elements to create the fluid and sophisticated improvisations characteristic of urban modernism.
Of course, the foundations (counterpoint, classical harmony) must be laid first, and one must wait until they are well set before building more “advanced” structures on top (in fact, the foundations alone are more than sufficient to create excellent music)…

It takes years of study for a deep understanding of foundations and many more years of craftsmanship practice to transfer this understanding to your ears and fingers.
You must not learn a style but the language:
only in this way can you discover your own style.

Recommended Readings:

“Counterpoint in composition”
by Salzer-Schachter

“Harmony”
by Piston

“Trattato di armonia”
by De Ninno

[CidolofasOrlandu]

Those Gregorian Priests had the best money making idea ever.

[jazzedb]

So true, spent 20 years and went to school to study music formally to learn the scales. 20 years later I don’t even really use them, so just play chord tonality and the color notes in between. Clarification, my approach to soloing is more chordal shaped rather than linear scalar and that makes a huge difference.

[vivsavagex]

Modal jazz doesnt have a whole lot to do with the modes themselves. the genre is more defined by tunes that stay on a chord for a long time.

[miguelherrera]

Barry Harris was such a likeable, no nonsense, piano Master.

[PhilKnowltonBand]

That's more or less like a painter saying, "I don't know anything about pastels! I just paint lighter colors." If you can make it work without formal study that's great. If you need to study that's great too. Also if you're like me and a total theory nerd and lean and practice the stuff regardless of if it's needed because you find it fun... I know we're weird, that is also great.

[kentbrooks]

I get it. I have my music degrees now, but when I was playing in church at 10 years old, I only used my ears and creativity. I saved money for college as a teen playing on Sundays and jazz sets at parties. It's also how I paid my tuition. I didn't know what a mode was until college. Now, I'm a university professor. There are many paths to get to your destination.Some are unconventional but still valid.

[joshhampton]

Barry is simply stating that when he was learning and studying with the Jazz master of his day neither he nor his mentors were considering modes at the time. I believe that’s true. Many if not most jazz education programs do sell modes as the primary method of improvisation.

[ThatShadowHand]

The amazing thing about music is you can study different ways to learn about it and as long as it resonates with you, it’ll be effective learning.

Some people learn the modes and it unlocks their perception of their instrument. Others think it’s confusing. All are valid, for who it works for.

[foodhead]

Modes predate key signatures. Just because someone is unaware of their influences doesn't mean they aren't there.

[jarrilaurila]

Modes have been around for centuries. Barry being Barry.

[voriskinlaw]

I Have The Utmost Respect For Dr.Harris-P.R.I.H.P 🎶 --I Wish I Could've Participated In His Classes While Struggled Throughout College As A Music Major;However In Terms Of Modal Jazz WE WOULD'VE Went @ It!!!--MODES(Respectfully)Are Spiritual For Me, & It's Fun Creating Inside Improvisation Of Different Kinds Of Things./Eccl 1:9/3:15

[WalterHolstad]

I think at some point you can just play by ear. You have to do the work but your method of getting there can differ.

[gospelphilomath]

the "modes" are simply scale degrees or different starting points from the root of any scale quality.