The Impact of Modern Ethanol Fuels on Classic and Classic Race Cars

In this video we look at the nefast effects of Ethanol on classic cars and classic race cars and the use of Race fuel 102

[chriswalker]

Great video thanks, and what an awesome collection you have.
My 1974 Series three isn't too keen and I use the E5 with reddex and lead replacer, have changed all the lines and added a metal fuel filter and a big magnet to the bottom of my metal fuel tank. Did have to retard the ignition as you advise, and found this fuel if left in anything goes off, even forms gloopy stuff too😱. So on my garden tractor and mower ect I keep them empty, unless being used daily.
So many green initiatives are actually not very green it would seem !
Thanks for your take, please keep on making your common sense vids 👍

[cnat_sepll]

Funnily enough I just finished a University report about synthetic fuels in historic motorsport.

I found your channel because I wanted more info on SU and Webber Carb tuning, so I could describe how the engine must changed for optimization for different fuels. I linked your videos in the Bibliography of course.

I agreed that ethanol is definitely unfavourable for classic cars, and any exhaust emission inprovements from it are negated by its polluting production process. I suggest that methanol fuels cluld be a much better alternative

[mgtf]

Always interesting. Thanks Steve. Best to steer clear of any ethanol in older vehicles. 👍

[abcdefg]

Adding ethanol to to fuel is in fact an eco disaster, with ethanol added a vehicle is less efficient, so uses more fuel for the same journey, in fact all the company has done is added a liquid which mixes with the fuel to bulk it up, but adds very little to the efficiency of the engine, the other fact that you did not mention Steve, (or I missed it) is that ethanol is hydroscopic, and the amount of water that lays in the bottom of your fuel tank is proof of that, the good thing about that is it can be used to remove the ethanol from the fuel we put in our vehicles, I will not put ethanol fuel in any of my small garden machine engines, and a worrying fact is that even relatively late vehicles are now suffering fuel line leaks due to the effects of ethanol, it is revealing how much ethanol can be extracted from pump fuel, this varies quite a lot from batch to batch, but it must be done to preserve our engine systems, significant is the fact that aviation fuels are not contaminated with ethanol, that should indicate something to the public. Stay sane! Chris B.

[drewpierce]

Good suggestions for us all. Thankfully, enough time has passed here in the US and Europe that proper replacement carburetor gaskets, fuel lines, and seals are easily found at any good auto parts store. Retrofitting my 1950 Chevy truck with a 1960 6 banger for ethanol took less than a day to complete. Tuning was by driving feel, so that took longer. On track days, I don't know anyone running ethanol additive fuel in their race car.

[ClassicCarCave]

Steve, Thanks for the info in this video but do you have a company name or source were we can buy rubber fuel line that is ethanol resistant🤔👍. Cheers Dave

[marcusd]

A great video yet again. U neaver fail to amaze with ur vast knowledge and the spread of things u can do. I would love to more about and how u gain so much knowledge and skill.

[kathysarmcandy]

Steve, as a 40 year Toyota Master Tech in the US mid West. I've never seen alcohol issues at E10. Unless..., fuel systems have sat or years. Then we've seen carb fuel system corrosion in atv's that get little use. But for bi-yearly vintage car runs, nothing. Power equipment, cars. We run E10 daily. If I store a piece; chainsaws, etc, its gets Sta-Bil. But then I have a 1960's mower, that gets run ever couple of years. I don't treat the gas. It start every time. I've questioned my Austin Owner's Club in England about alcohol fuels and they have regular issues with alcohol. Maybe its the materials. For me, I just walk out and start my tools and cars. Now saying that, three years of gas in my friend's Corvette, no start, its game on. Maybe the rubbers in Europe are poorer. Dunno. In the US, ethanol doesn't affect much.

[gregorymacneil]

Great informative video! Ethanol is also a disaster in small engines.

[rolflyden]

Hi. Great video as always! Very instructive and easy to understand.
On a side question. What are your thoughts on unleaded fuel and classic cars?

[ovalwingnut]

Thank you for taking the time to inform the uninformed. The "check is in the mail".... Cheers from So.Ca.USA 3rd House On the Left

[MichaelM.]

In regards to replacing the fuel lines; you can't trust the new rubber lines you installed either so check them regularly!
We had replaced the rubber lines on 3 cars from different retailers/manufacturers and they all started bleeding fuel after 4-6 months, all from dry rot around the ends presumably caused by the ethanol ...

[gydson]

ethanol “dries out” the friction pairs in the fuel system, the fuel pump, the injector needle, detonation, another important and depressing point is the rate of degradation of fuel with ethanol. Hydrolysis - fuel exposed to water for a long period of time begins to chemically degrade.
Microbes – Microorganisms can live in liquid fuel under certain conditions, and they will multiply rapidly, eventually destroying the fuel.
Oxidation – Excessive exposure to oxygen results in the formation of acids as a by-product.
With all forms of deterioration, the result is that the liquid fuel turns into a sludge or sticky compound that can no longer be used and can damage engines. Excessive exposure to temperatures above 30 degrees Celsius will accelerate the deterioration process.

[johnmcmullen]

A problem I have had with E10 fuel is its short shelf life, at which point it goes stale with a tell-tale foul odor when stored several months. The fuel goes bad even sooner when mixed with oil for my 2 cycle lawn equipment. That's probably why ethanol free fuel is available at most boat marinas. I experienced a ruined carburetor on a new Lawnboy push mower after stored its first winter, and small engine repair shops will confirm the damage E10 has caused. The key is keeping a fresh supply and using an additive like Sta-bil if ethanol free gas is unavailable in your area.

[tedohio]

I have a 1963 Ford Galaxie with an original 427. Where I live fuel with no ethanol is readily available and I add some 110 octane racing fuel too the mix.

[Hessuttelija]

Doesn't ethanol actually increase octane rating of the fuel and not decrease it?
So I made few searches. *E85 ethanols octane rating is 103. It is used to increase octane of "bad" fuel. So more ethanol in your fuel is not bad, but having high enough octane is important. There is a reason why people (me included) use e85 as cheap race fuel on turbocharged cars.

Other points in the video are still correct.

*fixed a word

[paulfisher]

This is a very interesting discussion and thank you for sharing your point of view and explaining it all.
There is also the question of valve seats with lead replacement fuels. Is it doing what lead use to do?
Now on classic cars, Can you get replacement mechanical pump diaphragms? The original ones are hard to find as it stands.


Regards,
Paul

[dadoVRC]

Ethanol has a slower flame speed compared to gasoline, and also it's more knock resistant.

If you hear detonation in your race engine tuned for non-ethanol gasoline, is only because ethanol is making the air fuel ratio leaner.

Also...
A higher flame speed doesn't cause knocking.
Knocking is caused by a slow burning rate mixture (like a lean one), since a slow burn rate gives time to the external area of the combustion chamber to detonate.
The faster the flame speed, the less time the peripheral area of the combustion chamber has to develop detonation.

[SlackrDav]

so I would be interested to know the differences to timing advance between a car tuned without ethanol fuel, and with ethanol (5 vs 10%). Would there be an actual risk to where you would need to decrease timing by a few degrees to account for possible pre-detonation? Would be fun to quantify

[bleizbreizh]

I understand that ethanol fuel burns cooler, gives a little more power and a little less Co2. As its the only thing available at the pump we have little choice but to work with it on a classic car so I will have to make those mods you talk about