The exact moment the 'Debate (on John 6) Ended' between James White and Leighton Flowers and Why:

In a pivotal moment of intellectual exchange, the debate between James White and Leighton Flowers reaches a climactic juncture. Flowers concedes a critical point: If White’s interpretation of the Greek text is accurate, then the TULIP doctrine stands affirmed, and conversely, his own stance is untenable. This concession marks a technical conclusion to the debate, underscoring the profound impact of scriptural interpretation on theological positions.

Link to the full Debate:

[CCShorts]

If the Provisionist God is not able to "teach" sinners and cause them to "learn" any different than a secular college Professor is able to with his students then the Provisionist God has no more ability [to actually SAVE sinners] than a gospel Preacher does on Sunday morning.

This is the "god" that Leighton Flowers is promoting in this debate.

[MrJwright]

Anyone watching this clip needs to watch the entire debate.

[Terrylb]

James white: what does the text say. Dr Flowers : but this is what makes sense to me.

[CaldwellApologetics]

Dr. James White has played this clip on the Dividing Line. If Dr. Leighton Flowers simply reviewed Isaiah 54 and Jeremiah 31, which John 6:44-45 cites then it is obvious that it is a monergistic work of God in view.

[ronaldhendricks]

The Great James White:

“If i’m right, am I right?”

Leighton Flowers:”Yes.”

Calvinist everywhere:”Flowers just conceaded the debate. Our Titan of the faith is 2-0 against that man centered Pelagian.”

Real compelling stuff coming from the Calvinist camp.

[ReformedHandyman]

It seems like Mr. Flower's entire argument is hinged on the word "learns" in v45. He is arguing that those who have not just "heard" but also, "learned" from the Father come to Christ. This acrobatic move reshapes the scope and flow of the argument to put the power back in the hands of the "learning" person. So in summary God draws those who have learned in Leighton's eyes.

The issue is that the exegetical work Mr. White did shows the flow of the text in context. That is that the crux of the issue are unbelieving followers of Jesus who found him for the wrong reasons (food). Jesus confronted them and directed them to come to him for Life. Jesus also said more than once that the reason they don't believe is that they aren't:
1. Given to him by the Father's Will vs 37-39
2. Drawn vs 44
3. Taught by God vs 45
4. Granted by God vs 65

All of these statements point to the requirement of God's intervention (not man's vs 63). This clearly shows the Trinity in salvation by the will of the Father through the work of the Son by the power (sovereign/effectual call) of the Spirit. While we all agree man is a participant it is clear that this is a sovereign work of God at the core.

Jesus even ended the by saying, "Didn't I choose you?" This indicated the source of their faith based on everything he previously taught in the chapter.

Jesus often said. "He who has ears, let him hear." Thinking of this statement compared to John 6 one must ask, "How does someone get the kind of ears that they need to hear Jesus?" John 6 and other places would say, "From above... or from the Father."

[Eben_Haezer]

For those who may have gotten lost in the debate, here’s the main crux of the debate, with JP's comments at the end.

Flowers’ argument

No one [whole] can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him [subset]; and I will raise him [same subset] up on the last day. It is written in the prophets, ‘And they shall all [whole] be taught of God.’ Everyone who has heard and learned from the Father [same subset], comes to Me.

White’s argument

No one [whole] can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him [subset]; and I will raise him [same subset] up on the last day. It is written in the prophets, ‘And they shall all [still the same subset] be taught of God.’ Everyone who has heard and learned from the Father[still the same subset], comes to Me.

The arguments boiled down to who is the “they…all” that shall be taught of God.

Is it only the ones drawn who are taught, listened, and learned?

White: Yes

Flowers: No

Is it all Israel taught, and the ones who listened and learned are drawn (and come)?

Flowers: Yes

White: No

Is there any change in the “who” and “how” Jesus will draw in John 12:32?

Flowers: Yes

White: ???? No maybe??? Not clear

That’s pretty much the debate on how each side reads and argues from these verses.

JP comments:

Since Flowers believes that Jesus was only gathering a subset before the cross/exaltation anyway, he could actually affirm or grant White’s entire interpretation above (even if he thinks it’s wrong) and Unconditional Election still does not follow from it.

Even White admits some in the crowd could believe later (assuming by UC or whatever, but that doesn’t matter).

The only thing that does follow is temporary rejection (of each other) by both Jesus AND by the audience.

Temporary rejection ≠ Unconditional Election

Now, Unconditional Election may be true on other grounds, but Unconditional Election is not proven even on White’s reading of the text of John 6. He can presuppose it on those other grounds, but that’s irrelevant and question begging. He had to prove it from this text. He didn’t.

[andresbenavides]

It wouldn't be practical to go out and preach the gospel with the idea in our hearts that God may or may not want them to be saved. Even if we think that preaching the gospel is an enormous privilege, when we do not truly believe that God loves people and desires that all people repent and to turn away from their wicked way of living, we will be lying to them and our preaching would be dishonest. I say this because we, in our church regularly go out and talk to people about the Gospel. I just couldn't take Dr. White's pints of view. Blessings brothers in Christ

[josiahpulemau]

Within this Particular debate between the two, John 6:65 ends this debate 👀

John 6:65 NASB95
And He was saying, "For this reason I have said to you, that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted him from the Father."

Further confirming what was said in 6:44

[johncollier]

Mr Flowers' beliefs don't smell too good.

[jethroscooter]

Flowers is a warning for others, showing the dangers of liberal thinking.

[eugenegerman]

Context is not about every individual person though but about who would be Jesus' disciple that God granted and drawn.

[rogervincent]

It was the Romans 9 debate all over again. It was a colossal waste of time. These two should never debate again.

[ReformedShirt]

Thank God for faithful men who rightly divide the word of truth! We all need to be studying the covenant of God more than we do.

[illadvized]

Wow. More calvinists vs provisionist. Let's just divide ourselves even more. That's always a good thing

[stevehardwick]

Leighton, " I know what the Bible says, but will believe what I want instead."