Unlearning Your Pain w/ Dr Howard Schubiner

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Today I speak with one of the world’s foremost experts on pain management Dr. Howard Schubiner @hschubiner. Dr. Schubiner is the director of the Mind Body Medicine Center at Ascension Providence Hospital in Southfield, Michigan, and a Clinical Professor at the Michigan State University College of Human Medicine. He has authored three books: Unlearn Your Pain, Unlearn Your Anxiety and Depression, and Hidden From View.

Dr. Schubiner is also the co-creator of Emotion Awareness and Expression Therapy (EAET), an evidence-based, highly effective psychological treatment for chronic pain. He was part of the team that conducted the Boulder back pain study which demonstrated that 75% of the people with chronic back pain treated with Pain Reprocessing Therapy recovered fully and documented the changes in the brain that occurred with this treatment using function MRI scans.

This is a fascinating and really informative conversation on the nature of pain and how we can overcome the suffering it causes. I hope you enjoy listening.

LINKS:

Mind Body Connection Animated Video Series:
OvidDx
Curable App
Lin.Health

About:
Dr. Howard Schubiner is an internist and pediatrician, who attained the rank of full Professor at Wayne State University School of Medicine in 1999. He is an internist and the director of the Mind Body Medicine Center at Ascension Providence Hospital in Southfield, Michigan. Dr. Schubiner is a Clinical Professor at the Michigan State University College of Human Medicine and is a fellow in the American College of Physicians, and the American Academy of Pediatrics. He has authored more than 100 publications in scientific journals and books, and lectures regionally, nationally, and internationally and has consulted for the American Medical Association, the National Institute on Drug Abuse, and the National Institute on Mental Health. Dr. Schubiner is the author of three books: Unlearn Your Pain, Unlearn Your Anxiety and Depression, and Hidden From View, written with Allan Abbass, MD, a Professor of Psychiatry at Dalhousie University in Halifax, Nova Scotia.

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[RobLewis]

I'm praying for everyone with pain. There is hope. I'm also praying that I can live a full life regardless, forget my symptoms and do what I have to do.

[laurabehenna]

I discovered Dr. Schubiner and his work a month ago and have been doing what he says to do. My long covid symptoms have improved at least 50% in that time and I'm looking forward to a full recovery. I'm very grateful for his important work and to all those who spread the word about it.

[susanleigh]

This is so refreshing! I am open to the possibilities of being pain free again. Thank you so much!

[privateperson]

This guy Dr Schubiner is GOLD and A - mazing !! TY for the interview, Thank G*d for Dr's like him and that he is sharing SO much online - how humble and generous of him. My Dr's reaction to 2O years of chronic pain is to let me suffer. They do not offer me drugs, except Paracetamol; and NSAID's, which I can no longer take. They just do not know how to help you. It is understandable - but to be just left to suffer - it is awful. And some of the reax from Specialists was degrading and just a terrible experience. I AM GOING TO DO THS STUFF HE TALKS ABOUT . I have always said, after 2O years of chronic illness - the only person who is going to be able to heal this is - ME. I don't know how - maybe now I have the keys from this Dr - but if I can't do it, no Dr can do anything for me.

[markhayman-martinez]

It's a huge and important point that "The pain is real".. because with the current atmosphere of medication-averse young MDs, a patient gets hyper aware that their doctor thinks that they are "drug seeking" when they even MENTION that there could be an emotional aspect. You've GOT to start with "The pain is real".

[sharonlujan]

I have to tell you dr. Shubiner, I finally got totally free of my pain an moved into a new apt. this only goes to show you all your theories are correct. Im no longer living on that busy street an walking to the busstop every morning!! I am safe resting and only go out when I actually need to

[nargisbbyounis]

I have been struggling with back problems for over 4 years, someone suggested my pain maybe neuroplastic. I completely dismissed it and would not entertain it. Something changed about 3 weeks ago I started reading and watching videos about pyschosomatic pain. Knowing that there was nothing structurally wrong with me (had mri, X-ray) I decided to give the techniques a go and I’ve dramatically changed in my pain levels I actually can’t believe it. In the back of my mind I sometimes still go back to thinking there is something wrong and I still feel pain. But the pain intensity and my fear levels have changed so much.

[ThePettyCelebrity]

I get everything the good doctor said, but the years of misdiagnosis to millions and millions who died and of ruined lives...This is the reprocessing point where my thought pivots...I am thankful I'm still alive...Anyways, I am glad this conversation is getting to more and more people.

[MulberryWombat]

I started using this approach as a massage therapist with my clients and am already seeing huge progress in chronic pain cases across the board. Thanks so much for bringing this information to light.

[veronikaong]

Thank you so much to both of you, I have heard about Dr. Schubiner, it has been a great experience in my search to finding the way to recovery, 👍👍🤞🤞🍂🙏

[sharonlujan]

My pain is here from the loss of a loved one

[SellyNue]

I feel conflicted: on one hand, i have structural pain, if i would sign consents, I have surgeons who would move forward with no less than 6 surgeries. Its comforting knowing that my brain isn't "creating the pain". On the other hand, it seems that it would be easier if my pain was "just" TMS. Even when i take the assessment, I don't score a "TMS score".

[jimholland]

Thanks Karim...great interview with Dr Schubiner, heard Howard talk many times, but it's always great to hear again!! Very comprehensive / helpful discussion.

[Tinyteacher]

Lyme, bacterial infections, viruses, rheumatoid factors, Ankylosing spondylitis, bulging discs, mold toxicity, chronic strep, autoimmune diseases, etc. are all contributing to my 69 year-old body. I ache so bad, I feel useless now.

[Helena-nucr]

An example of say bulging or herniated discs causing pain, & some people with these diagnoses not experiencing pain, surely it would depend on whether the bulge/ herniation is pressing on nerves or not ?? If the bulge was pressing against a nerve then that is real pain yes?

[CharlotteBruce-yj]

I'm in that in-between stage where I presume I have nerve muscle damage from repetitive strain at the back of my neck and not knowing if I now I have m/b or I'm still healing. I'm in pain every day and have been for over three months. Mri showed 'normal wear and tear for 47.

[pattyboucetta]

Doc, if our TMS is self punishment due to parental guilt how do we teach the brain there’s no danger?

[BethHutch-pgyi]

what do you do when I can't even find how I should do it? How do I do mindfulness How to meditate in this pain?

[tmbarry]

Every option should be available to people in pain.

[robinelliott]

Dr. - could this apply to Protracted Acute Withdrawal Syndrome - something that happens to people who have tapered off prescribed benzodiazapines??