1 John 5:6-8: Controversy, and (hopefully) some clarity

[colleengainey]

Thank you for this. I was reading this this morning and needed clarification. I had not realized the controversy. I appreciate your clear teaching. God bless! 🙏☕️🕊🎺🎶

[korispradlincox]

Great video, yiu answered a lot of my questions. I remember seeing something a few years ago about passages missing in the new versions. I do wonder why was the passage added though if they weren't in the original text.

[kacisearsy]

Interesting.
I’ve never heard this.
Thanks for being transparent.

[ladydarklyn]

Definitely food for thought! Thank you very much for this in depth insight into the correct questions and pointers to look to when choosing a version! It's so hard to select a version because there's so many and hard to tell it's from the original Greek, Hebrew and Aramaic

[jamessheffield]

A circumstantial case for the Comma of John: In 484 A.D. the bishop of Carthage with 400 bishops quoted the comma to an Arian Vandal king. Being the bishop of Carthage, he would have had access to the Scriptures of Cyprian, and he probably had a Vulgate, maybe a first edition. Also, Gregory Nazianzus wrote on the grammar, and he had a student named Jerome. Seems strong evidence to me. Blessings.

[jennifershipp]

Hmm I guess I never read that much into these verses. I will have to do more reading into this. Thank you.

[whoaracehorse]

I can’t help but to hold fast to the King James. I consider the butterfly effect, something perhaps to be aware of in the different “versions” of Bibles. Thoughts?

[kayelane]

Very interesting teaching! I remember when I first read this passage in different bibles. I've heard people say that satan has changed the bible but I just can't imagine God allowing His word to be changed to the point of misleading us! I've found another interesting difference: Matthew 24:36 the KJV does not include 'the Son' in the passage about no one knows the day or hour. I've not done any investigation into the original manuscripts but I do find it interesting...

[TheMistysFavs]

Pastor Brian -- I am VERY PASSIONATE about this, I meant NO disrespect.. I just saw my tone isn't always so great, I'm sorry. I want NO ONE to be deceived by ANY "versions".

[InfinitelyManic]

The absence of the Comma from 1 John 5:7, 8 from the Greek mss witness for almost 1400 years is utterly astounding and must be given its proper weight as external evidence. The first three (3) Early Modern English Reformation Bibles marked 1 John 5:7 as doubtful or omitted it. Luther's first German Bible omitted the Comma.

[rebeccahughes]

This would be an interesting topic to look up but water memory. I slight explanation would be how sound or frequency(in my opinion like spirit or energy) affects water and how it tastes freezes and literally everything about the water. A test done to prove this is true dog which have a taste buds for water would choose the water that had higher frequency sounds play "to it" prior to offering versus low frequencies. This would also explain why a plant that has "positive" energy towards it versus "negative" and the out come of growth. I think we have all come across this experiment at some point if not totally worth a search to prove what I am talking about.

I love connecting science with spirituality.

[evertbakker]

Its a very intresting topic Brian, there is tree big arguments the muslims makr about chrisianty
1- Jesus is not the son of God
2- the argument they use that is excecly the topic you talk about, they say that the bibel is changed and for that not be trusted ( but they go very high on abraham and mozes and maria and Jesus aswel.
3-Jesus did not die but was like Eliha resurected.

So your indepth make it more easy to explain what and why it happend with the bibel.

Thanks for that

[Derby_City_Dasher]

I believe the Johannine Comma is legit and it's not just verse 7 it is also the first half of verse 8. Vesrse 9 tells us "If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son." I don't think God would give us the testimony of his Son and omit both his heavenly and earthly witness.

1 John has the 2nd fewest manuscripts of any book of the New Testament except for Revelations. There are only 2 papyri of 1 John. 2nd century papyri of P9 which only has 4 verses from chapter 4 so it's not a witness for or against. Then there is 7th century P74 which has significantly for more verses, but is missing the entire section that would pertain to the Johannine Comma so it's not a witness for or against either. So the papyri is irrelevant to 1 John 5:7-8.


There are at least 2 10th century Greek lectionaries. The 10th century is within the uncial period so that is ancient.

I would also dispute the commonly made assertion that no Church Father quoted or referenced it.

Athanasius (Born 296-298, died 373) “But also, is not that sin-remitting, life-giving and sanctifying washing [baptism], without which, no one shall see the kingdom of heaven, given to the faithful in the Thrice-Blessed Name? these three are one.‘”

I'm well aware that most scholars today don't attribute this citation to Athanasius, but no one questioned it until the enlightment era, but that does really matter. The composition date is still believed to be very old so even if not Athanasius you have an ancient Greek source here making what reads like a direct reference to 1 John 5:7 when he says In addition to all these, John affirms, ‘and these three are one.‘” Where else does John affirm the 3 are one, but 1 john 5:7? This very well could've been right around the time of the Nicene Council.

[markhmorrison]

Fascinating! Some good dialog on this. Thanks for tackling it.

[TheMistysFavs]

1 John 5:7 -- Only verse describing the Godhead being ONE.. 1 Timothy 3:16 - Only verse that says GOD did those things, versions change to HE..People think HE is Jesus, not God.. Acts 20::27 -- Whole counsel of God is changed to "meaning of God" (REALLY?) Daniel 3:25 -- "Looks like the Son of God" changed to "a son of the gods" (REALLY?) I have a LONG list. The Bible "versions" are a deception...They MUST have 110 changes to obtain a copyright, using the King James as their "Original" (so I heard)..Yesterday I read in SAVED magazine, the NIV had a Trans Lesbian on the translation board who took "sodomite", "effeminate" and other "undesirable" words out of the NIV and changed them to things like "Temple prostitute" NEVER touch a filthy version, only the King James.. OH ADD that the Alexandrian Texts were corrupted by Westcott and Hort, and the Sinicanus was found in a DUMPSTER for a reason.. We KNOW where the Vaticanus came from.. You don't know about the Alexandrian manuscripts being corrupted? Come on, man! (Joe Biden imitation) NO, they are NOT "very small errors"! See Chicktracts channel.. LEARN!! David Daniels has studied this for DECADES and the NIV and the ESV are the two
I watch TWO Pastors on here who do NOT use the KJB - you and one other... He is closer, using the NKJV, I'm still emailing him. (David Daniels wrote a book about how the NKJV killed his faith and all that's wrong with it.. ) Jesus warned HOW many times to NOT be deceived?? REMOVING Scripture is disobedience to God and it is slapping His face... EVERY version does this.
(I use the Biblical Godhead --as an ex-Roman Catholic, I know where "Trinity" came from)

[St.MosestheBlack]

I personally read KJV while my wife reads NKJV. I used to be a KJV only type guy but I've grown in Christ and recognized that his message and Word has been preserved through countless translations. Some find KJV hard to read and understand. I would point those people to ESV. Id hate for someone to put down the Word because they cannot understand the archaic language of the KJV. The final destination and goal is reaching Christ and his redemptive work on the Cross. Good message brother.