Let's talk about DAC's! The Topping D90 Mklll & D10B (ESS Sabre), Vs the SMSL D400EX (AKM)

For many people 'all DACs sound the same'. But do they? In this video I look at the Topping D90 Mklll, pairing it with its preamplifier counterpart, the Topping D90 Pre. By way of illustration, I evaluate its use of the 2 X ES9039SPRO DAC chips and then compare it with SMSL's D400EX which uses 2 X AK4499EX chips. For a control, to compare them both against, I use the Sugden Saphire DAP 800. Which one sounds best? Finally, I ask the question can the much lower priced Topping D10B (also using a Sabre chip, the ES9038Q2M) sound as good as its flagship big brother the Topping D90 Mklll? I also explain a useful way to listen out for differences between DACs.

All the sound samples are free to download from our website (see link below), so you can hear exactly what came out of the microphones!

Topics covered:
00:00 – Introduction – Why the topics of DACs and why now?
06:45 – The Topping D90 Mklll
09:32 – SINAD Signal to noise & THD & AudioScience reviews
16:12 – Some info on the SMSL D400EX
20:07 – My first impressions of the differences between the D90Mklll and the D400EX
24:33 – Introducing Joris Vanvinckenroye – Double bass player & composer
25:27 - How to hear the differences between DACs. What to listen out for
29:16 – Sound clips: SMSL D400EX Vs Topping D90 Mklll Vs Sugden DAP 800
32:37 – Sound clips: Topping D10B Vs Topping D90 Mklll
34:56 – The credits

Content Links: Music
Your free of charge set of the comparison test soundtracks (click on ‘Music’) at:

Recommended Tracks for comparing DACs:
Joris Vanvinckenroye: ‘Cycles’ from the CD Basta:
Steely Dan: Cousin Dupree, Two Against Nature:

Equipment Reviews and related topics (SINAD etc)
Amir AudioScience Review SMSL D400EX:

[ShimaKiyoshi]

You always, reassuringly, talk so much sense on this topic. Thank you for taking the time to share your views.

[guystpierrecomposer]

Interesting topic! Dacs sound differences are indeed sometime very small… but the rest of the chain and the attention put in listening is crucial! For myself, in a medium revealing system (Lintons and SMSL VMV A1) I tested the ess in a Primare SC15 versus my mojo 2…. And oh boy. The mojo 2 is so much more natural in the midrange… very easy to ear. Thanks for the discussion!

[IceMuppet]

As a long-suffering music listener, I realised that there is no perfect solution to audio reproduction as everyone has a subjective view of what music should sound like. Every room is a complex environment to start with, and so forth, and this is especially true when higher end products are concerned, there is no definitive measure of the 'sound' other then the numbers and the opinions of others in often, very different circumstances, my approach is simply, listen in your specific system/room for a while and if it is more enjoyable than previously, only then should you consider the upgrade, if the differences are worthwhile.

[이창만-qk]

In order to properly use a DAC's high S/N ratio device, the signal must be transmitted to an amplifier with a high S/N ratio for proper performance.

[familiekruit]

Ok, I believe you can hear the difference between a low end DAC and a high end DAC. Hearing the minimal differences between two high end DACs? Unless one of them has very high distortion (colors the sound) I find that questionable but perhaps possible. Expecting people to hear the difference through a microphone recording that then goes through the YouTube audio compression codec and is then rendered on whatever sound system is on the other side is something I consider pure insanity. The reality nowadays is that modern DAC chips are near perfect. If any difference can be heard it probably in the opamp/output stage or in the fact that ESS chips have slightly louder output signal than AKM chips.

[oz]

Probably a bit late to the party but i did prefer the Topping over the SMSL. The Topping had a more live sound. That Sugden though had it beat in the timbre department and had the most natural sound to me. I have the Basta! album and the first generation D90 and the new D90 does sound better than the original, which has a single AKM chip. Good comparison.

[JoseFerreira-zbwh]

Some reviewers have said the smsl gives the impression of a wider soundstage while the topping sounds a bit narrower, more closed in in comparison. What's your opinion on this? Also, i've red somewhere the preamp section in the d90 iii worked nicely, without requiring a dedicated preamp when connecting to a speaker amp. Again, what's your take on this? Thanks in advance.

[이창만-qk]

In fact, with a low THD, you can feel the clarity properly, and you should see a music playback range of 200Hz-2KHz, and Topping E70 has a lower THD than Topping D90 3 sabre or D90 3 discrete.
Please check the corresponding curve values ​​in the THD performance table.

[fredglaesner]

I have 2 McIntosh MC-30 mono blocks that require a preamp. Am I correct in my understanding that neither of these boxes function as a preamp and a DAC? Also, if you have a DAC and you feed into a preamp with a DAC, what is the result? Thanks for all responses with knowledge related to my queries.

[adamant]

Listening to your Sugden DAC impressed me the most while the D90III was the least impressive. Great presentation and analytics. Keep up the great work sir.

[jeffchristian]

Even with all of the fidelity and compression problems inherent to a YouTube video, with a good set of Sennheisers, I could hear the difference. Your analysis was spot on (to my ears anyway). Surprised how good the D10 sounded. Very similar to the D90, but not as wide or deep. The D90 had just that little bit extra detail and decay. The Sugden and SMSL sound veiled in comparison. Thank you for this extremely educational video.

[youtube改名也太難了吧]

As a D90III user, the D90III did sound very good to my ear. Still looking forward to their future discrete dac.

[mojahangard]

Good afternoon, just wanted to thank you for your outstanding video where you managed to eloquently explicate your experience with both DACs. I was on the fence for some time and upon watching your video, opted for the Topping d90 III. Enjoying some good ole music right now. Thank you very much again.

[AaezZzze]

Which DAC would you recommend for monitoring purpose only for mixing / mastering ?
Meaning I don’t have any hardware and don’t need AD, just DA, for critical listening on headphones, that I could pair with an amp.
I was thinking about Lynx Hilo but it also does AD and I don’t need that ( it has a good headphone circuit built in tho )
Topping has great measurements but it’s made on sine waves, not complex music, and they don’t sound very realistic to me.
Thanks 🙏

[rsdex]

The speakers and room would have more effect than any dac. Get the best speaker you can get. And set them up correctly. I have recently been messing with mine by adding some foam to the sharp edges around the tweeter. Well boy did that make an impact. Amir will show in his measurements that DACs are transparent.

[terrywho]

Outstanding rundown comparing the three DACs. Very insightful and quite helpful. Thanks!

[ColocasiaCorm]

Ive heard that the d90 suffers limited soundstaging.

I’m not sure if or how a dac can affect soundstage.

How did you feel?

[johnnydingo]

Having spent a lot of time modifying CD players, building power amps and electronic crossovers and many hours of listening, it is abundantly clear to me that the analogue sections in the electronic chain ultimately have a great impact on the sound we hear from the speakers. Not to mention power supplies etc. Since the DAC comparisons include an analogue section with some type of output amp inbuilt to the DAC unit, it is difficult to evaluate the actual DAC part. In reality we are comparing the actual DAC part followed by the analogue section and the quality of power supply as well as design and the quality of components used. Which means there are quite a number of variables in the reproduction of the music. Just my two cents 😊

[hayno]

I also think that your emotional state is a key factor in what you hear in the music and your enjoyment of it. If you are relaxed and in the mood to allow the music to flow over you, it will.

[andymill]

Thanks for the great review. I have the 'original' Topping D90 (with AKM) and the Topping D90 MKIII. I have downloaded your files and I am anxious to here if there are any differences between the both Toppings I have.