Overshoot & Climate Change with William Rees

In this Climate Chat episode, we discuss the issue of ecological footprint overshoot and climate change with Professor William E. Rees.

William Rees is a bio-ecologist, ecological economist, former Director and Professor Emeritus of the University of British Columbia’s School of Community and Regional Planning. His early research focused on environmental assessment but gradually extended to the biophysical requirements for sustainability and the implications of global ecological trends. Along the way, he developed a special interest in modern cities as ‘dissipative structures’ and therefore as particularly vulnerable components of the total human ecosystem.

Rees is perhaps best known as the originator and co-developer (with his graduate students) of ecological footprint analysis—the expanding human eco-footprint is arguably the world’s best-known indicator of the (un)sustainability of techno-industrial society. His book on eco-footprinting (co-authored with his former PhD student, Mathis Wackernagel) has been published in eight languages, including Chinese. Rees is also author of over 150 peer reviewed papers and numerous popular articles on sustainability science and policy. (And sometimes the lack of policy—his recent writing focuses on biological, neuro-cognitive and socially-constructed barriers to progress.)

Prof Rees’ academic work has been widely recognized. He has served on numerous advisory committees and lectured by invitation in 30 countries. Rees is a founding member and former President of the Canadian Society for Ecological Economics; a founding Director of the One Earth Initiative; and a Fellow of the Post-Carbon Institute. He was elected to the Royal Society of Canada in 2006 and, in 2007, was awarded a prestigious Trudeau Foundation Fellowship. In 2012, Prof Rees received an Honorary Doctorate from Laval University, the Boulding Prize in Ecological Economics and a Blue Planet Prize (jointly with Dr Wackernagel). He was elected a full member of the Club of Rome in 2014.

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Dan Miller has been giving talks around the world on the need for urgent climate action for over 20 years. He is co-founder of The Roda Group, a climate-tech venture capital group, and he serves as an advisor for other climate funds and climate-focused non-profit groups. He started Climate Chat in 2021 on Clubhouse and added YouTube in 2023.

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[basiaurbanczyk]

William Rees is bang on. Reality is so hard.

[jean]

Thank you Climate Chat team. This was the first time I've heard from Prof. William Rees, I really enjoyed hearing his realistic and well thought out ideas and perspectives. I will be watching more of his interviews and lectures.

[frujf]

We're still increasing CO2 emissions. That says it all. Degrowth will come, but it won't be voluntary, it won't be gradual, and it won't be pretty.

[mirandelf]

Thank you for talking about carrying capacity! I read William Catton’s book Overshoot a few years ago and it explained the heart of our situation and predicament. I have been disappointed that so many speaking currently about climate don’t seem to know about it to the extent that the term ‘overshoot’ has been coined recently in a way that is completely ignorant of the incredible understanding that Catton brought to this issue.

[JeffQuirk]

What an incredibly thought provoking chat. Gives a completely different angle to what we need to do. Thank you.

[robertcurtin-desr]

Brillant Presentation-Kudos To Dan Miller And Prof. William Rees!!!!

[howardbreen]

Implementing global degrowth and significant population reductions to counter overshoot is arguably politically and socially far more challenging than fossil fuel phaseout and individuals adopting a plant-based diet (the latter Bill does not acknowledge as a significant act by individuals). There is concern that urgent degrowth strategies might disproportionately affect developing nations striving for improved living standards given that wealthy nations are reducing their climate finance pledges. That said I agree fully about celebrating declining birth rates worldwide and adapting socially to the resulting environmental improvements at the expense of economic growth.

[ignaciocasodedios]

Dear Friend : Very good interview .Doctor William Reers is right . The inertia our civilization has, is so so huge .I believe is like an Airplane landing whithow wings and wheels . Anyway we are going to crash no matter what currently we try . Individually or collectively.
Thanks

[seankennedy]

Amazing facilitation. You let William talk as he desired (many facilitators don’t), while also directing the conversation in an interesting direction. This is the first video I’ve seen of your channel - subscribed!

Really disappointed in William’s response regarding animal agriculture, though. He could have just said he doesn’t know much about it.

[shannonwilliams]

Dead ended at William Rees it seems. Nate Hagens great hopeful project only seems hopeful to he and other comfortable guests and fans because he himself has a comfortable life. Therapist, life coaches, constant flights, high profile guests, marginal celebrity, endless meditative bike rides, etc. Rees doesn’t let his Western privilege blind him in the slightest. He’s the best.

[beefandbarley]

To solve our climate challenges we need wisdom, restraint and cooperation. Make of that what you will.

[radman]

Absolutely brilliant discussion. Thank you for providing it. Bill Reese has been a great influence on me and I was lucky enough to get exposed to his lectures quite a while ago. Thx again.

[SixSigmaPi]

Excellent interview. The very final point is very valid - follow the data, that shows where we are headed.

[sultanbev]

35:39 UK still uses coal for steel making, although neo-liberal economics is trying very hard to shut down what little steel making we have, just at the same time as Europe is going to "rearm, baby, rearm".

[MichaelWolfe]

I'm all in the mindset of Mr. Rees. The population situation is all tangled with semantics. A "stable" population can't be sustained in the long run. Positive feedbacks are not necessarily desirable and so on.

[thf]

Damn, I stopped watching this channel since they never got real about overshoot and collapse. Maybe Dan will finally get off the copium. "Oh, I totally agree. But what about all of these not less than impossible and evil hypotheticals?"

[chrisconklin]

Thanks for the presentation. I have followed climate change and renewable energy issues for some time and have your food print book. There are a growing number of references to population decline. Sooner or later we will have to address the issue.

[chadreilly]

Stacy and Dan, I appreciate you asking my questions, regarding the green transition. I feel like Bill left a little wiggle room by saying it's not happening. Whereas Jensen's book Bright Green Lies suggests that it "can't happen" and would only further and massively contribute to climate change and ecologic destruction if we attempted to make it happen.

I believe Jensen, and I think Bill's papers back him up, but absolutely contradicts Mark Jacobson, but given this isn't my field, I can't assess the actual requirements myself. So it would be great for you guys to have Derrick on and give him a friendly grilling of his information. Andreas Roos would be another good person as he's publishing research to this effect, but last time I heard his English is a bit halting. His podcast with Derrick a few years back is a good overview, with Roos having received his PhD since. His work has been largely centered on the expense, EROI, and social costs of solar. Having Eliot Jacobson in the audience to confirm or deny the math would be good.

[dianewallace]

I'm a chemist. I am a huge proponent of the energy transition. I also know we have already crossed the tipping points of permafrost, methane hydrates, and the decline of phytoplakton.

[robbietulip]

In considering planetary carrying capacity, a neglected factor is that the world ocean contains 1.2 billion cubic kilometers of water, with average depth four km. All the water deeper than a few hundred metres, below the thermocline, is rich in nutrients. Bringing these resources to the surface can enable a quantum leap in planetary abundance, with a new circular economy. The oceans have immense capacity to support new growth of biomass, not recognised in this discussion by William Rees. The resulting processing of oceanic biomass using hydrothermal liquefaction will create vast new sustainable commodity industries in fuel, fisheries, fertilizer, forests, food, feed and fabrics. This 7F approach requires far simpler new technology than stalled examples like the fusion reactors mentioned by Rees. With will and vision, ocean biomass can rapidly develop to protect and enhance Earth System Stability at climate relevant scale.