Live: Abolition Debate w/Jeff Durbin & Samuel Sey

Join us for this new episode of Apologia Radio in which we engage in a live debate/discussion between Jeff Durbin and Samuel Sey on the issue of abolition vs Pro-life. Tell someone!

[ApologiaStudios]

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[theianbush]

Wow. Samuel's inability to see that pro-life legislation will never end abortion is mind-bending.

[joys.]

TIMESTAMPS (that hopefully stay accurate)
7:16 intro starts
8:43 talking
11:26 intro to the topic & guest Samuel Sey
13:20 the behaviour & langauge of certain abolitionists/behaving in a Christ-like way
21:37 Samuel's view
24:31 Samuel talking to Kristin Hawkins
29:45 the terms of the discussion/what the pro-life movement believes
38:08 the victim narrative of the pro-life movement, claims about enemies
45:12 banning but not regulating abortion, punishing the mother
52:44 would Jeff support abortion ban that penalized those involved but without the death penalty?
1:01:43 is it possible for a bill to specify not being about penology? Would Jeff support it? Partiality?
1:15:26 Jeff's more thorough response
1:18:31 more clarification of the things previously discussed
1:23:18 Question from a dude in the chat ...aaand some rabbit trails
1:27:10 break
1:30:08 return: a matter of justice & category errors & partiality by outcome or intention
an interesting piece on Canada
1:37:35 Jeff's response: biblical partiality
what even is partiality anyway??
the audience is tired & there are category errors apparently
1:47:12 Sam condenses: are we making distinctions or preferences??
there's context! So much!

i am losing my sanity. will finish up later

[ryanbeaver]

I had to delete my first response because I wasn’t done listening yet and thought Sam just wasn’t understanding. I was really trying to see brother Sam’s perspective and even agree with it where I could, but I just believe he’s wrong here. Sam seems anxious almost trying to win a debate, but it’s a hard brotherly discussion. Pastor Jeff is right and maybe Sam is struggling a bit because Jeff just has such a wealth of knowledge on the ground working within the legislature. Love and appreciate both brothers, but Jeff is absolutely right on this from a Christian perspective. Great discussion to listen to though, learned a lot. 🙏

[JonSpeedTheBookScout]

They cannot claim to hate it when they write the bills that define specifically how babies may die.

[ihaufle]

This should have been a moderated debate.

[santosconcepcion]

Love the conversation among brothers who can disagree with conviction and yet love each other without waiver and pretentiousness.

That alone brings me to tears.

[NathanielWiggins-rz]

The law is a teacher. If current pro-life bills shield women from any punishment, what is it teaching them?

[GracetoThee]

To think that Pastor Doug Wilson comes down on the Samuel Sey side of this is mind-bending.

[JonSpeedTheBookScout]

Consider the definition of the word “equal” in equal protection.

[erica]

This was painful to watch. You’re an incredibly patient man Jeff.

[johnmarshall]

Incrementalist blow my mind…I can’t imagine they would argue for an incremental approach if child rape was currently legal.

[theianbush]

Samuel talks for 2-3 minutes uninterrupted, but then complains that he can't get his point out. That's an issue on his end as a communicator, if that's true.

[chrisdc]

tbh, it sounds like Sam is an abolitionist but he dislikes abolitionists.

[TKK]

The next time my boss asks me why I was late to work, I’m going to tell him that’s a category error

[juliewyatt]

So according to Mr. Sey’s logic, it is permissible to do evil so good may come (in our pragmatic perspective) as long as our intentions our good.

[yourfriendlyneighborhoodin]

This morning I was trying to look up the open letter that was sent out and signed by 76 organizations to the Louisiana legislature in May of 2022, begging them not to pass EAN's Bill of Abolition.

I found it on the Apologia radio's episode from May 19th 2022.

[JonSpeedTheBookScout]

How do you work with people who conspire to kill your bills?

[joys.]

I totally forgot this was happening today, otherwise I would have started on the timestamps sooner! It'll take me some time, but hopefully they'll be done before tomorrow.

[acbagel]

I have listened to all of Sam's debates on this issue. He has a poor understanding of facets of the how theblaw functions, and constantly creates hypothetical analogies that are category errors. I appreciate the discussion though and respect him because he is one of very few supporters of the prolife movement that at least attempt to debate it.