Modeling VS Sampling | Which Creates Better Digital Piano Sounds?

When it comes to digital pianos, the main task at hand facing engineers is to reproduce two things accurately: the SOUND or tone, and the FEEL or touch of an acoustic piano. When you press an acoustic piano key, it activates a hammer, which then strikes string(s), which, in turn, vibrates and makes a sound. Add to that the complex tonal interactions, such as string resonance, damper resonance, cabinet resonance, and natural reverberation, then you see Digital Piano manufacturers have their work cut out for them reproducing this complex sound. Currently, digital pianos use one or a combination of the methods of Sampling and Digital Modeling to reproduce the sound of an acoustic piano and other musical instruments. We are here today to delve into the question of Modeling VS Sampling...which is better? #DigitalPianos #Roland #Casio #Yamaha #Kawai

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[DiCelloPiano]

This was a great talk, thanks for doing this - As a pro-pianist, I did my last concert on a Steinway D and I'm still all for the progression of digital piano :), I wouldn't use them in live settings unless something really changed, but for home / computer work like MIDI, recording MIDI, making teaching videos, or even just recording something that sounds real is really an excellent tool to be able to use ....

[thegoodgeneral]

I have to admit at first I was impatient—I wanted a straight-forward answer to the question, I thought I knew better than to be forced to listen to a history lesson… but man I got so hooked on the discussion and I learned so much. Bravo, gentlemen.

[georgehardisty]

I'm retired and started taking piano lessons a couple of years before I retired. Played trumpet in school, a little rythm guitar and played bass guitar in a local band back in the 70's. I enjoy your talks about pianos and music. I bought a CLP 675 about 1 1/2 years ago and like it a lot. One day I will make it sound good too. I am about 5 years along in my journey of learning piano and consider myself still a beginner.

[echochambers]

Nice history lesson. You guys need to get a segment on the History channel or Discovery channel. Seriously!

I suspect that over time all higher end digitals and keyboards will allow the user to select a sampled sound or a modelled sound as the default sound. There is no reason to make blanket comments that one is superior to the other. Why not welcome and enjoy both? Each person will have a sound that they prefer, just like we all prefer different types of music. And of course you can expand a keyboard's onboard sounds with some outstanding VSTs that continue to showcase awesome sounds themselves. The fact that we have so many options and those options can be adjusted to your hearts content is simply fantastic. Good stuff.

[GFhornet]

Best modeling piano: pianoteq 7: Stainwey D New York, U4 a la Monk and Petrof Mistral warm.

[thomasbrown]

Thanks for a fascinating video. The explanation of how e pianos developed and digital sampling vs. modeling is very informative. I am a novice who only began taking piano lessons a year ago (at age 68) and am liking it enough after a year that I expect to continue doing it as long as I have left. I use a Yamaha p515 which I think sounds great, even though it really doesn’t approach my teacher’s 100 year old rebuilt Steinway grand (nor would I expect it to, despite the quality of the CFX and Bosendorfer instruments used for the samples). My interest was in finding a reliable, good sounding, but affordable instrument that would allow lots of practice, and the 515 does a fine job. How it would compare with a similar Kawai or a modeling piano like a similarly priced Roland, I don’t know, but I like to hear your reviews and explanations. Thanks!

[leaningtower]

Great video! Thanks guys.
I am a musucian but also a mixing and mastering engineer. Oh man, nowadays virtual analog synths like Diva, modeling pianos like Pianoteq, but also AI driven mastering services have come so far that really scares me

[damish]

A very interesting topic, and I learned quite a bit today. Thanks for addressing the subject.

[Alexhangman]

I like sampling more then modeling. For example i like "Production Voices - Production Grand 2 Platinum" more then "Pianoteq 8".

[DonswatchingtheTube]

How do they model a sound?
Is it started from pure mathematics?
Could they record a sound and convert it into algorithms?
How many different ways could modeling be achieved or do they all use the same, or standard mathematics (algorithms)?

[geoffk]

Good Modeled pianos like Pianoteq are just as good as sampled pianos. In some ways they are better. A sampled piano will have two or three sounds per key, plus 128 MIDI volume levels. But small differences in volume will either give you no change in tone or an unexpectedly large change as you switch samples. By contrast, a modeled tone changes naturally and differently at each volume level, which can be more expressive. The polyphony can also be better, which is important for genersting resonant harmonies. That said, good sampled pianos like the CFX and Bosendorfer on the Montage are also excellent instruments.

[markhomiak]

Fascinating topic. Just tell me who's the best. I'm going crazy. I was once considering Roland, but I'm down to Yamaha (CLP725 or 35) and Kawai (CN29 or 39).

[rawl]

Interesting topic and you all made some interesting points about how modern h/w sampling engines have some some PM functionality included. But honestly, I was hoping to get the answer to the question about which is superior now. Is there now a h/w synth or digital piano with true physical modeling synthesis that has surpassed the best sample based h/w synth engine available today? Or even equal? That is the $64, 000 question I expected to hear you answer. And echoing other comments here, PianoTeq's PM emulations are at least as good and perhaps now even better than the best sampled s/w pianos out today, IMHO.

[xiehe]

It is great to learn some new knowledge. such as the original sampling piano which combined the modelling timbre in the decay. or how difficult it is to live the grand piano in the open sound system then derived the invention of synthesis. The ear is so sensitive to capture any flaws in the modelling system, inharmonicity, beating, knocking and so on, really hard to simulate the physical piano. I wonder if it is possible to give any reference to this piece of history? many thanks.

[southpark]

That was brilliant I can relate to the 'munchkination effect'. After getting out of range -- such as too high ---- the pinging tin-like effect.

[SBell]

What do you think of the Synchron Piano for having the Concert Grand of the Steinway, Yamaha, Bosendoerferr? Is there one that has the Petroff?

[tuneunleashed]

Sample Pianos are much more detail and Modelling has much more features and playability is incredible so I do like the technology of Modelling but when it comes to sounds? Sample are taking over for now but Physical Modelling has the potential to take over some day.

[joytekb]

Model is a robot but sample is a picture of acustic piano its feauters, imperfections,micro craks, paint, type of wood and so on

[RabbitConfirmed]

Damn.. I feel kinda bad having bought the Roland FP90X now.

[chrisr]

Do you think rolands sampling is a superior way to reproduce a piano sound compared to kawai, Yamaha?