Ultegra Di2 12 speed is the worst choice. But why?

Why Shimano Ultegra Di2 12 speed is the worst group set choice you can make for both performance and cost.

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[benshane]

SRAM doesn't even offer mechanical groupsets for road at this point. I realize you can still find the stuff out there, but the point is that they are betting (their entire business) that people will buy electric over mechanical. Electric shifting is like having a dog. If you've never had one, who cares, but once you get one, it's like how do you ever go back to not. Your point about getting to the gear you want quickly makes sense for mtb, gravel or riding at a very leisurely pace on the road, but if you're racing or KoM hunting, it's more important to have the most efficient gear possible as much of the time as possible, so the extra step in the middle is definitely helpful. It's not like you're gonna be swinging from the 11 all the way to the 28 and back again, over and over and over. Also, you're exaggerating how much this stuff costs. I just picked up a full 105 Di2 group (for a customer, not my bike) for $1205 US retail. I think the same place was selling the R8150 group for $1650, which is like $2500ish AUD. Still stupid $ for a group, but a lot less than you claim. VERY few people are thinking about this stuff. Most people just want to buy a bike and ride it, and will buy whatever bike they can afford with the fanciest features. Also, like 99.9999% of electric shifting works perfectly, without any attention being paid whatsoever to it's upkeep. If people keep their drivetrain clean, and charge the bike once a month, they can ride their bike for years without ever missing a single shift of having any issue or maintenance cos. You factor in that almost every bike is internally routed these days, and the cost (or time) of replacing cables and housing every season becomes a bit of a nuisance. Also, nobody gives two shits what anybody else rides, be it microshift or super record, idk maybe that's an Aussie thing?

[jffydavy]

Buying an electronic shifting system, made by anybody, is not on my list at all. I have no desire to own. It won't make me any faster. I only ride it when I installed it or serviced it on someone else's bike. Shifting faster won't make the bike faster. Your legs do that. As this trickles down to lower prices the manufactures will add one more feature....auto shifting. A computer will sense your speed and your pedal rpm and shift to the efficient gear you should be in. You will get no choices.

[ShowMeThePony]

It’s so encouraging to see someone your age saying these things. My
Hope for the future has been reignited.

[bobowsinski]

Di2 has been a god send for me. I have limited use of my right arm. Cannot use paddle shifter on right. So I could not upgrade from my budget center activated shifting. With DI2 I was able to program the DI2 to shift with sync shifting with only left paddle. Beyond that the shifting is precise and once set is idiot proof.

[nunocecilio]

So many stupid points made... Saying that electronic groupsets are ok if you disable or lazy, is just dumb, if you have short hands you will appreciate it, the ease of use of di2 is noticeable, the shifting performance is better, no gear cable breaking... More, comparing the lightest groupset ever (sram red 11sp rim brake) with the new ultegra 12sp di2 is just dumb... If you have to compare do it with ultegra 11sp mechanic or di2. Saying that di2 is way worst to maintain is just false, if you brake some part is worst because is expensive, but if you don't brake it is virtually maintenance free. The reason to buy ultegra vs 105, ultegra is lighter, have all the old features on di2 and some more, and have the exact performance of dura-ace. Why you shouldn't buy dura-ace... Price price price... Just one more thing... Climbing gear 23, 25, 28...😅 Climbing gear is an 32, 34, 36... Which is the highest gear an regular cage sram red 11sp derailleur can get to? So that is not an negative in this days?

[gerrysecure]

I don't want electronic shift because I have already waaaay too many batteries to keep charged. However my ultegra has cables hidden going through many bends and shifting in winter with numb fingers is a real annoyance where I wish I had Di. My old Campa Record was infinitely better as one could shift up with the thumb while sprinting.

[kevinshaffer]

You can tell this guy doesn't have any friends

[ThomasAnselmi]

It is 16. I have both r7000 105 with 11-30 and Ultegra r8100 with 11-30. The ability to more often be sitting in the most efficient gear more often is one that I very much underrated. I'm not sure I would ever go back to mechanical groupsets after putting about 5k km on my 12spd Ultegra di2.

[lucky]

There are some real differences between ultegra and 105 Di2 that can make it worth considering. The front shifting is far faster on Ultegra and there are additional buttons on the shifters that some people think are highly beneficial.

[janicekierstead]

I have had Di2 Ultegra for seven years now, over 25K miles, it’s genius! Best upgrade, no doubt! Works great! Much better than mechanical shifting, full stop

[maxsievers]

In my opinion DI2 is the first iteration of indexed shifting that is not a nuisance. Finally Shimano got it figured out.

The advantage of motor shifting is not only that two motors are handling the chain for you — and it's not only that those motors do it faster and more precise than a human could ever do it. _The main advantage is that derailleur gears shifting is made to be as simple as planetary gearset shifting._

The computer knows which gear I'm in. When the next defined gear needs a shift in the front it does it and compensates with a predefined number of shifts in the back — and trims the front derailleur accordingly. The rider does not need to think or know about all those details.

[aten]

For some reason I ignore, you don't only seem to hate this particular groupset, but above all people buying it. Why are you so bitter ? Is that jealousy or are you just an obnoxious person ? If people like to have nice equipment, regardless of performance, weight, price, etc. or just have a geeky side, what's wrong about this ? Regarding the uselessness of 12 speed, yes you can have the same cassette's extremity-cogs, but when you ride, especially in montainous terrain, you'd be glad to get finer cogs spacing. nb: I ride 105 mechanical 10 speed

[karlschleifenbaum]

Yesterday, I got a beautiful Look bike with the last steel frame they made (1997) and it has a Campagnolo Racing Triple 8 speed, and I'm amazed at how well it works. The full multishift and trimming on all 4 shifters are neat features. My Di2 failed in the lowest gear, so why bother with that bs? I'm fed up with the modern plastic infested and marketing fueled rubbish.

[MrHUAHUE]

Harder to maintain?! What maintenance do you need to do on Di2? Clean it?

[milovacc]

12 speed cassette. I still remember when it was not recommended to run the chain on the large chain ring with the large rear cog on a 6 spd. freewheel.

[ozgurinsan]

front shifting on di2 is so much better than mechanical, even that's enough to buy.

[dwaynepedals]

I have Shimano Ultegra R8000 mechanical on my road bike and Shimano GRX Di2 on my gravel bike. Electronic shifting is the best hands down and I'll be getting it on my road bikes in the future for sure. Weight gains is marginal if you ask me and the electronic shifting outweighs that.

[awhite]

My 10 year old Tiagra derailleur failed last year (lost its tension), because of newer pull ratios being different it was difficult to replace. Thankfully my excellent local bike shop had an old 10 speed Ultegra one laying around (from someone who had upgraded to an 11 speed), so they cleaned that up and installed it cheaply. Shifts like a dream and looks great! Mechanical all the way.

[AnthonyGilliland]

Well, I am 64, been riding since I was 14yrs old. As a lifelong athlete, anything I can do to stay fast, I do. Also, with arthritis in my hands (especially my shifting hand), this helps a lot. I do agree that the price tradeoff is not there...at all. Its obscene what we are being charged for this stuff, but I do not care, I'm pretty wealthy. But with Shimano's rapid product phasing this type of runaway expense is going to be a "barrier to entry" for young cyclists. As far as the functionality is concerned, its pretty amazing especially in the semi-automatic mode. I really like how it automatically shifts you back to your spin pace when you drop to the lower gear ring. It creates a seamless shift when climbing. Overall the shifts are much smoother, require less effort and do not require the mental/physical energy deep into a long hard ride when fatigue sets in and your prone to "chunk" a shift. There is one item that really bugs me on the 12spd setup. This could be an adjustment phase I will go through, but I am getting the sense that its a struggle to find the optimum gear and this setup will require more shifting then you may be used to. Conversely, even with 12 gears, it gets messy right in the middle range of the cassette and I seem to have to push a higher gear at times than I want to because the right pace/gear seems to always be in a slight cross-chain situation. To straighten the cassette/gear ring relationship I end up in to high or low of a gear. I am using the 11/30 gear ring as I write this. So, my initial evaluation is this, the creature comforts are nice, but where it counts most Di2 12spd is a flop in my mind. My 11spd Ultegra bike with a 11/30 Cassette is simply better. I agree with Regi that my 2006 Litespeed Ultimate with a 10spd powertrain is simply perfect compared to the newer stuff. However, being that the legs are not what they used to be, I opt for the tradeoff of more climbing ability.

[RogueMechanic]

Lolol…opinions. We all have them. Sounds a bit retro-grouchy imho. I stop way short of insulting folks when they ask for my opinion or advice on component groups. But that’s just me. The decision when deciding between mechanical and electronic shifting is not a binary one. There are many other factors to take into account, not just if someone is “disabled.”