The Chilling Reality of the Forever War | Is This Humanity's Future?

The engagement of the United States' in the Vietnam War followed the end of World War II in Asia in 1945. Initially the US had minimal involvement but this would change overtime. Over the following decades the US’s involvement increased dramatically. The height of U.S. military engagement in Vietnam was in the spring of 1969, with nearly 550,000 American troops on the ground in the country. By the time the United States was done, in March 1973, over 3 million American citizens had served in Vietnam.

Starship Troopers by Robert Heinlein was first published in November of 1959. Since then the book has gone on to be praised by some, and criticized by many for its portrayal and some would say glorification of war and the militarization of humanity. The Forever War by Joe Halderman, written 1974, was created as a response to Starship Troopers. It includes staunchly anti war themes, relating to the pointlessness and cruelty of it all.

These were of course not the only two works of science fiction by that time to have themes surrounding warfare and the military. Alfred Bester’s 1956 book “The Stars My Destination” though more of a revenge story involves significant conflict and military elements. HG Wells also included elements of warfare and military style conflicts in his works including his most famous 1898’s War of the Worlds. Phillip Francis Nowlan’s 1928 novel, “Armageddon 2419 AD” explores themes of survival and resistance in a post-apocalyptic world, and the fight against imperialism and colonialism.

Joe Haldeman's "The Forever War" drew inspiration not just from earlier science fiction, during and before the New Wave, but also significantly from his own military service.Haldeman was drafted into the United States Army in 1967 he served as combat engineer in the Vietnam War. His time in the military as well as the sense of alienation he experienced upon returning to America was the inspiration for this novel.

The Forever War explores the sense of alienation often felt by war veterans upon returning home, and the sense that time is slipping away, that emerges when people spend so much time away from home, protecting the ones they love from a distance, only to come back and realize that the world has moved on without them. Joe Haldeman uses a sci-fi universe, containing elements like time dilation, in order to drive these themes and ideas home. The Forever War is the story of the brutal and long lasting war between Humanity and a race of Alien beings known as the Taurans.

The Forever War has long been considered a masterwork of science fiction, and I agree, it deserves its legacy. It is also a highly influential work in science fiction and has left its mark on the genre in a significant way. There are certain aspects of the novel that come across as dated, and we’ll get into those later, but in general the forever war was a great read, and its core ideas are presented very well. Keep in mind, this video will have spoilers for the Forever War.

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[bigpup]

When I came back from Afghanistan, at 3am I flew into Boston and was greeted by a group of Vietnam vets saluting and shaking our hands. These vets told us they wanted to make sure no soldier came home ungreeted like they were. It made me cry then and it makes me cry now. Edit: apparently my story is controversial. No I don't agree with everything that happened in Afghanistan, I joined as a medic to help people and that's what I did. I have love in my heart for every race and religion anyone who ended up on my table was treated to the best of my abilities. I am a single human who's belief can and did disagree with my government. I shared this story because I thought it was relevant to the topic of the video. You want to try to hold me accountable for my government's position. I suppose that's your prerogative or you could ask questions and I will share my honest opinion and feelings about my time and experiences.

[nobody]

Actually, we in the industrial complex prefer the term "Sustainable War" as it is more accurate to our long-term goals.

[sunniedunbar]

There was a serious brain drain too. Soldiers needed to be smarter due to the conditions of a war in space. Our smartest sent off to die.

[xPantsMcGeex]

Fry: "I heard one time you single-handedly defeated a horde of rampaging somethings in the something something system"
Brannigan: "Killbots? A trifle. It was simply a matter of outsmarting them."
Fry: "Wow, I never would've thought of that."
Brannigan: "You see, killbots have a preset kill limit. Knowing their weakness, I sent wave after wave of my own men at them until they reached their limit and shut down. Kif, show them the medal I won."

[khango]

I am a native Vietnamese with family and relatives from both sides of the civil war, and have experienced life both in Vietnam where I grew up and in the US. I read The Forever War during a period of great but also traumatic emotional development. I can relate in an odd way to the main character of this book, and by extension Haldeman himself. Great read, i always revisit the book once a year.
P.s. I did not grow up during wartime, my parents were children in the waning years of the war. However the impact of the war was still felt in someway by children of that generation. Some families, from both sides, came out of it worse than others. And some children have inherited more inter-generational trauma than others.

[thenight]

"In the grim Darkness of the far future, there is only war."

[xtremeranger]

Little tidbit is Heinlein loved reading the Forever War and personally congratulated Haldeman receiving his Nebula award.

[jeffdishong]

I served in Bosnia . Alienation affects most soldiers to some degree.
I am forever stuck in 1997.

[bitterlilraccoon]

Sexuality themes aside, Forever War suddenly reminded me of one of my favorite (and first) sci-fi universes: Battletech. The setting itself is designed to perpetuate war and alienation as a theme which crops us like weeds in every aspect from the novels to the games. Humans merge with machines to become gods, nation states form, split and cannibalize each other like a forest of bacteria under a microscope. In at least one story arc, the descendants of a great war hero self-isolate to avoid being caught in a pending series of civil wars, only to then return to the setting hundreds of years later as a techno-eugenics cult with bizarre customs hell-bent on reconquering the Earth. Who needs aliens when humanity does a splendid job of making aliens of itself?

[yankeepapa]

Haldeman's character became a "regular" due to a total lack of ability to reintegrate. Most of my generation who served (I just turned 75) pulled one tour of duty and then took the dive back into society...with mixed results. I turned 21 a month after my enlistment in the Corps up. I looked 14... Entering college was an adjustment in the Fall of 1970... Not a "hostile" campus environment...but alien for all that... The people who graduated from high school in the Spring of 1970 and moved directly to college very different from so many who graduated in 1967.
.
In 1965 a Marine infantry squad leader (Sgt.) might have been 24 or 25... In 1969 he might be 19 or even 18. War not only inflates the currency...but also the leadership. The Corps went from 170, 000 in 1965 to 300, 000 in 1968. "War is boyish...and is fought by boys..." Herman Melville YP

[kevingrozni]

The Forever War has always been my favorite SF novel. I'm also fortunate enough to have had Joe Haldeman as a professor during the years he taught writing at MIT. A great book, and a great man. Haldeman fun fact: after having been wounded twice in Viet Nam, he was shot again in Florida while riding a bike along the highway.

[JerR]

"War is a racket. It always has been. It is possibly the oldest, easily the most profitable, surely the most vicious. It is the only one international in scope." -Smedley Butler

[davidhanson]

I first read this in the early 80's. My brother was a big scifi/fantasy reader and first handed me Starship Trooper. I thought it was great and then he handed me Forever War afterwards. Forever War blew me away. I enjoyed Starship Trooper, but saw how shallow it was compared to Forever War. It was my first encounter with time dilation. I loved this concept in science fiction.

[mbaxter]

The Forever War is a timeless classic. It made more of an impact on me than any other sci-fi I ever read as a boy. I was thinking about it for years.

[kenban]

Glad to see Joe Haldeman getting coverage on this channel. One of the first sci-fi writers I read, and still one of my favorites. A gritty, brutal, cynical take on war.

[dontforgetyoursunscreen]

Always interesting to find a video which hasn't been out long enough for someone to have watched the entire thing yet

[micklaws]

Thank you, as always, for your insight and analysis. As a Vietnam Vet, after I got home I was adrift and a stranger in my own country. I managed to finish a degree then left to work overseas, for most of my life.

[Tigerblade]

If this is your research, I find it thoroughly impressive, Sir. Something that I hope to emulate. I am largely self-taught because I find it difficult to learn in a classroom environment. I have found out recently that it was exacerbated by ignorance of my recently confirmed autism. So, at 65 years old, I hope to improve my abilities as a writer, composer and researcher by studying how people such as yourself do your work since emulation has been the main process I've used to educate myself. i am quite sure after you read this, you'll dismiss me as some wacko. That's quite alright, I am used to it. Thank you very much for sharing your fantastic insight once again.

[jesseberg]

I think it can be hard for some of us to really understand how radical some of these ideas were, because of how obvious they are to us. Yes, TFW's handling off sexuality is crude, awkward, and ultimately selfdefeating. But the simple fact that it wasn't "gay=bad" was radical for its time. We should also try to keep in mind that the audience he was writing for wasn't used to this message, and may have needed to have it repeated, just to be able to hear it.

[bcrev]

As a vet with 32yrs of service, thank you. This was an excellent analogy.