The problem with extra dimensions | Roger Penrose, Avshalom Elitzur, Claudia de Rham

A debate about the viability of other dimensions turns to the complexities of quantum mechanics.

Can the past be changed?

Most of us take it for granted that there are three dimensions, perhaps four if we count time. But for over 200 years, mathematicians and scientists have proposed further dimensions. In some standard versions of contemporary physics eleven dimensions are now proposed. But might the notion of additional dimensions be an empty idea that derails physics? Richard Feynman argued that proponents of extra dimensions "cook up explanations" for what we can't observe. And CERN researchers admit that no empirical evidence for extra dimensions has ever been, and more importantly perhaps could ever be, discovered.

Should we reject talk of higher dimensions as fantasy, good for sci-fi movies but not for theories of the universe? Would we be better to see extra dimensions as a mathematical tool rather than a description of reality? Or might multiple dimensions in fact describe the essential character of the world?

#physics #multiverse #stringtheory #quantumphysics #quantummechanics

00:00 Introduction
00:15 Roger Penrose on other dimensions
02:47 Claudia de Rham on other dimensions
07:47 Avshalom Elitzur on quantum mechanics
12:17 Roger Penrose on quantum reality

Nobel prize-winner Roger Penrose, philosopher of quantum mechanics Avshalom Elitzur, and theoretical physicist Claudia de Rham debate the possibility of multiple dimensions. Hosted by Güneş Taylor.

[TheInstituteOfArtAndIdeas]

Will we find evidence of other dimensions? Leave your thoughts in the comments.

[bendybruce]

Can we just take a moment to acknowledge that Roger Penrose well into his 90s is still able to demonstrate a level of mental acuity most of us will never achieve even in our prime.

[patrickgravel]

Sir Roger has a knack at putting really sensationalist views back into perspective. Good job.

[markcollins]

Roger deals with what is right in front of us, defines the elements, identifies one of the knots, and then untangles it or -- at a minimum, puts a clearer focus on the frame of reference of the problem field at which point he begins again... Thank you Roger for letting us see what you see.

[doublebass]

I think we are kinda naive to think we are going to solve this any time soon. The universe is a lot more bizarre than what we give it credit for..

[bittertruth]

An industry produces a product. Now, this product is attempting to decode the secret of how that industry came into existence in the first place. What the product does not, and cannot, know is that it lacks the necessary faculties to decode that industry.

[classicalmechanic]

Quantum mechanics does not effect the past. It effects the present which is relative.

[doublebass]

Why is there giant organisms (a few miles long) out in space that look like worms as something you would see under a microscope, but in a radiation spectrum apparently and not one we can see with our eyes? So the most smallest known organisms are also the largest so that's why I feel the universe is more in tuned with opposites. Or it really could just be that space is some form of fluid we can't see and that we know organisms grow larger in a larger environment so obviously out in space the organisms are huge (the video I saw of NASA in 1960's said 10 miles long)

[Psycandy]

and they use the man-made, energy-only virtual dimension, which technically doesn't exist without the circuitry to decode it, to communicate. can you travel back in time in this dimension? yes, invariably. forwards? nope. but prediction closes that gap, to rework 'the future' as 'certainty'

[WideCuriosity]

Surely in a block universe all possible futures and pasts exist. The question then becomes, is there a special route through the universe that has more validity, more reason to be called 'reality', than others ? And if so, then can we change that route to another in order, effectively as far as we are concerned, change past & future ?

[ozzy]

Why is Avshalom talking about QM? QM tells us that we are ignorant about most of the universe but it doesn't really point us in any helpful direction(s).
QM could only be used to say something profound about the universe if it were a complete theory that explained all quantum effects.
As Roger Penrose says, a better quantum theory is needed that tells us things like why the wave function collapses, why the quantum world is non-local etc.
Only then is this new quantum theory likely to tell us something profound about the universe.

[olalilja]

Roger Penrose is a master at having intuitions that are correct, so I listen very carefully of what ideas he has. Greatest mind of our time since J. S. Bach.

[polo-wvgs]

Sir Roger Penrose is such a fantastic communicator I was wondering what EPR was as a lamen. Now I can research it.

[axle.student]

2:51 To be fair the universe does not require more than 3 dimensions. We only need the pseudo extra dimension to make sense sense of it and describe it to ourselves :)
9:41 Kind of falls into the above. The concept of timing an synchronization appears to exist in all things, but I feel that it may be very different to what we may commonly think of as time. Just the same no additional dimension is required for it.
16:08 At best I could extend 3 dimensions to have 6 positive degrees of freedom :/
>
Not a physicists, just my thoughts on it :)
Thanks for posting the talk :)

[IzitAllGoUnder]

Changing the past while we destroy the future. "12 Monkeys". 🙄

[edstauffer]

If there is an inside and outside of spacetime then outside of spacetime there is no space separating things so you could take a shortcut that takes no time. Thus entanglement

[bretnetherton]

Awareness is known by awareness alone.

[SpotterVideo]

There must be at least one extra spatial dimension. Why?
If Physicists describe electrons as point particles with no volume, where is the mass of the particle?

Can one extra spatial dimension produce a geometric explanation of the 1/2 spin of electrons? The following is an extension of the old Kaluza-Klein theory.

What do the Twistors of Roger Penrose and the Geometric Unity of Eric Weinstein and the exploration of one extra spatial dimension by Lisa Randall and the "Belt Trick" of Paul Dirac have in common? Is the following idea a “Quantized” model related to the “Vortex Theory” proposed by Maxwell and others during the 19th century? Has the concept of the “Aether” been resurrected from the dead and relabeled as the “Higgs Field”?

In Spinors it takes two complete turns to get down the "rabbit hole" (Alpha Funnel 3D--->4D) to produce one twist cycle (1 Quantum unit).
Can both Matter and Energy be described as "Quanta" of Spatial Curvature? (A string is revealed to be a twisted cord when viewed up close.) Mass= 1/Length, with each twist cycle of the 4D Hypertube proportional to Planck’s Constant.

In this model Alpha equals the compactification ratio within the twistor cone, which is approximately 1/137.

1= Hypertubule diameter at 4D interface

137= Cone’s larger end diameter at 3D interface where the photons are absorbed or emitted.

The 4D twisted Hypertubule gets longer or shorter as twisting or untwisting occurs. (720 degrees per twist cycle.)

If quarks have not been isolated and gluons have not been isolated, how do we know they are not parts of the same thing? The tentacles of an octopus and the body of an octopus are parts of the same creature.

Is there an alternative interpretation of "Asymptotic Freedom"? What if Quarks are actually made up of twisted tubes which become physically entangled with two other twisted tubes to produce a proton? Instead of the Strong Force being mediated by the constant exchange of gluons, it would be mediated by the physical entanglement of these twisted tubes. When only two twisted tubules are entangled, a meson is produced which is unstable and rapidly unwinds (decays) into something else. A proton would be analogous to three twisted rubber bands becoming entangled and the "Quarks" would be the places where the tubes are tangled together. The behavior would be the same as rubber balls (representing the Quarks) connected with twisted rubber bands being separated from each other or placed closer together producing the exact same phenomenon as "Asymptotic Freedom" in protons and neutrons. The force would become greater as the balls are separated, but the force would become less if the balls were placed closer together. Therefore, the gluon is a synthetic particle (zero mass, zero charge) invented to explain the Strong Force. The "Color Force" is a consequence of the XYZ orientation entanglement of the twisted tubules. The two twisted tubule entanglement of Mesons is not stable and unwinds. It takes the entanglement of three twisted tubules to produce the stable proton.

[polo-wvgs]

Dark matter might be extra-dimensional mass with gravity that permiates our world perhaps?

[juanfelipegarcialuque]

Entonces, segun he escrito en el comentario anterior, El espacio esta ligado con el tiempo, el tiempo esta ligado con la evolucion y la evolucion con la aparicion de la consciencia aqui en la Tierra. Eso hace que la teoría del Big Crunch de volver hacia atrás, hacia los inicios de la inconsciencia ( ¿pero manteniendo la información ?), únicamente se tomaria como referencia a la física del Universo como materia, en un espacio elástico, pero sin consciencia evolutiva. Pero si cabria la teoría de un Multiverso dentro de un espacio infinito. Este tampoco seria un multiverso donde este Universo se repitiera una y otra vez de la misma forma siempre, sino que serian diferentes experimentos. El Big Bang o inflacion, como origen del Universo donde se concentraba, todo lo que es hoy el Universo entero en una singularidad menor que un atomo, es una explicación absurda. No se sabe que hubo antes ( No pueden saber cosas como la posibilidad de situandonos fuera del Universo observable haría que lo vieramos expandiendose como se ve aquí, entonces ya tendrian que poner los bordes de cada lugar donde el observador se situe, aunque sea un lugar que este mucho mas alla de los limites de observacion que hay hoy, como empieza sospechar las ultimas observaciones de James Webb. (¿ se crea masa a medida que se expande ?). Es mucho mas facil pensar que surgio de otra dimension, aunque parezca ciencia ficción, la física cuántica mira de reojo esta posibilidad . .
Como analogía, cada uno de nosotros, como personas, somos seres singulares, si, pero dentro de una especie común que ha evolucionado de otras especies, una pieza musical con diferentes melodias. Aquí en el mundo, la consciecia usa el conocimiento para manifestarse progresivamente.Una consciencia pura sin tener un medio donde aplicarse, seria una consciencia abstracta. Es aquí donde las formas se pintan en el lienzo del espacio, como medio para la manifestación progresiva de la consciencia. Un conocimiento sin consciencia nos puede llevar a la locura, a un sin sentido, lo mismo pasaría con una materia, unos atomos y una física sin consciencia detras, seria algo aleatorio, sin orden alguno, ni leyes físicas, sin sentido, basado en la total ignorancia, el caos, intento infructuoso de algo caótico y su desaparicion. La idea de un espacio finito, también es una mala idea. Decir que como el espacio se puede estirar y encoger da la opción a un Big Crunch ( implosion hacia atras, como destino final del Universo que se va encogiendo todo lo que se había expandido, como una película proyectada al revés, hasta volver al principio ), eso es tener una percepción muy limitada de una consciencia que tomaría un camino regresivo hacia la involucion, para crear otra vez otro Gig Bang que se repite una y otra vez. Eso es analizar el Universo con un mente, meramente física, mecánica, una consciencia limitada.
El Big Bang mismo es solo una explicación para dar sentido a la expansión del Universo. Esa visión se limita a la incapacidad de no poder observar mas alla. Si resulta que hay mas objetos fuera del campo de visión se quedara en una teoría que habría que cambiar, como empiezan a temer ahora con las nuevas observaciones del telescopio James Webb, el telescopio mas potente que haya podido crear el hombre. Los limites del Universo, está ligada a la teoría del Big Bang y no por el hecho comprobado de que el Universo sea limitado. La limitación esta en nuestra limitada capacidad para ver mas de ese 5 % del Universo observable desde aqui. No se tiene ni idea de hasta donde se podría extender si pudiéramos llegar a observar mas alla de nuestro limite de observación, resultaría que una visión mas amplia daría un significado completamente diferente a nuestra relativa y diminuta parte de nuestra observación, ( a nuestra capacidad psicologíca limitada ) una observación que en comparación con nuestro tamaño es inmensa, pero en comparación con el tamaño de una hormiga es muchísimo mas. La manera como trabaja la evolucion es ampliando nuestra consciencia, pero esta solo se puede ampliar acompanandola de un conocimiento mas amplio, pues como dije, la consciencia sin conocimiento es algo abstracto al no poderla aplicar a algo, asi que si la consciencia es infinita, el conocimiento también lo es. Pero que es la consciencia. El problema con eso es que entonces los astrónomos se ponen a hablar de la religión, de La Bibila, en particular. Yo mas bien, entraría en la metafísica del ocultismo y no soy un gran conocedor de lo oculto, he estado usando la filosofia. Pero si puedo decir cosas conocidas por el ocultismo budista tibetano acerca de la consciencia, sus características, como se ve en su estado, en el inmaterial del sutil, cosas mas propias de tratarlas en un monasterio budista que aquí. ( Aclarar que Buda tampoco fue un metafísico, su enseñanza es mas bien psicologica ). Aquí solo trato de dar mi interpretación filosófica de las hipotesis que hacen los astronomos.
Si este Universo fuera infinito, estaria limitado tambien, pues no podria evolucionar hacia algo aun no aparecido aquí. Por lo tanto ha de evolucionar hacia lo absoluto, lo cual tambien seria un limite tal como es nuestra percepción ahora de las cosas y los conceptos asociados, pero esto es debido a nuetra limitada intepretcion mental, por lo tanto, debe evolucionar en nosotros una consciencia diferente que nos permita entenderlo todo de manera diferente, pero con mayor amplitud.
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