Trudeau, Women, & Minorities: the Brutal Reality | Celina Caesar-Chavannes | EP 493

Dr. Jordan B. Peterson sits down with entrepreneur, author, and prior member of Justin Trudeau’s administration, Celina Caesar-Chavannes. They discuss her time in the Canadian government, the Prime Minister’s modus operandi, the use of tokenism over substantive contribution, and why she ultimately decided to resign.

Celina Caesar-Chavannes is a dynamic leader with an impressive track record across business, politics, and advocacy. Currently completing her PhD in Neuroscience, Celina’s research focuses on how cognitive and emotional processes intersect to influence leadership, decision-making, and self-actualization. She translates these insights into practical strategies for Cognitive Optimized Inclusive Leadership (COIL) - a program she designed to help individuals and organizations harness the power of their brain for authentic leadership, fostering deeper self-awareness, well-being, and transformation. Her leadership programs emphasize the importance of integrating neuroscience into leadership development to build more inclusive, empathetic, and effective leaders.

This episode was filmed on October 8th, 2024

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(0:00) The “We Who Wrestle With God” Tour
(0:43) Coming up
(1:15) Intro
(3:56) Celina’s role in the Trudeau Administration, an affinity toward liberal dynamism
(9:02) No prior political experience, knocking on 40,000 doors
(12:53) Celina’s background with her award winning company
(20:26) Serving as Parliamentary Secretary to Justin Trudeau: early excitement
(23:03) Very little interaction with Trudeau, not allowed to speak during question period
(30:31) Why there can’t be a gap between Parliamentary Secretary and Prime Minister
(33:31) Celina’s first meeting with Trudeau, “because it’s 2015”
(36:55) “Do you trust my judgment?” Apprehension at Trudeau’s flippant statements
(42:11) African-Canadian issues were tokenized, purposely left out of on-issue meetings
(48:59) The effects of being sidelined, loss of confidence and resolve
(52:04) “I had to be hyper-visible,” the stress of being on display as a black woman
(58:32) Personal reassessment and choosing not to follow marching orders
(1:04:57) Three establishes a pattern: why so many resigned
(1:06:36) When Celina told Trudeau she was leaving politics, “seriously not good”
(1:09:57) There’s more - Trudeau’s phone call
(1:12:44) Jody Wilson-Raybould, “sunny ways”
(1:15:51) Wounded narcissism, Celina’s last meeting with Trudeau
(1:24:04) Was it the right choice? Standing for what’s right over what is personally convenient

// COURSES //

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[BalikTrollbane]

God bless this brave woman for standing up to bullies and wanting to actually represent the people

[kathleenmacphee]

Jordan, thank you for continuing to cover Canadian stories and interviewing Canadians - I truly appreciate it, please keep it up! Celina, you are a badass and I'll be buying your book. Way to stand your ground and have integrity within a world of dishonest politicians.

[Alipotamus]

California woman here. Loved this. I pray and WORK for freedom everywhere in our world. Good luck Canada! 🇺🇸👍❤️

[robyruss]

Every Canadian needs to hear this conversation

[staceycampeau]

Bullied by the most powerful man in Canada and not only is she still standing, but she has the courage and strength to speak out. God bless!

[xjohnnydsonx]

Only 20 mins in. From UK but this lady brings tears to my eyes because the contrast between her real life experience and hard work and integrity and the likes of Trudeau and other non entities with power in all western democracies is shocking.
God bless her 🙏

[davidboda]

This is the face of bravery. We need more Canadians like this

[craiglasby]

Celina, it means so much to have you share your story. Please rest assured that many will deeply respect you for your service in an untenable situation.

[jmacers]

It truly is baffling how so many Canadians either can't or won't see through Justin's facade. What a wonderful interview, Celina absolutely deserved to be in a high functioning part of the Canadian gov't, and was denied the chance to really shine

[RtooGtoo]

I'm so proud of this woman for standing up for herself and her values. I couldn't be more endeared by her character. What a courageous individual.

[nachyomoney]

As an American and seeing the failures of both Canada's and my country's political leaders, I think it is time the people of our 2 great countries stand up and demand accountability.

[carmenboyd]

A woman of substance, integrity, intelligence, bravery! I would vote for her any time of the day! Fascinating interview….an inside glimpse that not all is as they say it is.

[Xenosonmatt]

This is why Canadians (for the most part) are sick of this lying government.

[Delux-HooverMax-model]

Trudeau expected her to “tow the line” and be a good “token”. He chose the wrong person. She is incredibly strong willed and self aware. Well done

[BabyDoll-pwhd]

Thankful for people like her!! This is what integrity looks/sounds like.

[karencherry]

😮Sounds like Celina was too smart for Trudeau. She was doing what all MP's should be doing! Taking care of her constituents and her role in the larger umbrella of Canada! A principled person kudos to her!

[GregoryCampbellSwag]

What an honour to have someone with such integrity, bravery and character serve in our government.

[fatimahrahman]

U.S. citizen here. I thank God for courageous men like Jordan Peterson whose courage enables him to interview other courageous people like this amazing lady who doesn’t mince words. Our world needs such leaders! 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼

[maryavanbeelen]

You're a courageous woman, Celina

[saltnlight]

An absolutely compelling interview. *Thank you*, Celina. You are an absolute treasure of a human being. It takes real grit and bravery to tell such experiences to a friendly face, never mind strangers online. If I may encourage you…it is absolutely *not* your fault that you were demeaned, threatened and bullied. Trudeau is to blame, not you. He bullied you because he is abusive, not because you are weak.

Thank you, Dr. Peterson, for bringing to light such important information. It was heartening to see your kind treatment of a traumatized person.

God bless you both. 🇨🇦❤️