Wendell Berry vs. Earl Butz debate 1977

00:10 Introduction to Dr. Butz
04:13 Dr. Butz - crisis vs. opportunity, nostalgia vs. progress
31:04 Introduction to Mr. Berry
31:40 Mr. Berry - relationship between society and agriculture
58:59 Dr. Butz - modern health, old vs. new ways of life
1:10:37 Mr. Berry - his own farmland, changing values
1:26:05 Q&A - horse farmers, the Amish, efficiency
1:32:24 Q&A - freedom, production quotas in the Tobacco Program
1:38:52 Q&A - land redistribution, adults learning to farm
1:41:35 Q&A - minimum number of farmers
1:42:54 Q&A - why don't people listen to farmers?
1:45:15 Q&A - how to redistribute land to farmers
1:46:58 Q&A - agriculture strike
1:48:07 Q&A - relationships between farmers, efficiency of big tractors
1:50:52 Q&A - loss of values, young people, Mark Twain

This debate between Wendell Berry and Earl L. Butz (Secretary of Agriculture 1971-76) took place at Indiana’s Manchester College on November 13, 1977. At the time, Berry had recently published his book The Unsettling of America, which included criticism of Butz and his role in promoting agribusiness. The debate was organized by English teacher Charles Boebel as part of the Life Schools Community Forum — The Crisis in American Agriculture, sponsored by the Indiana Committee for the Humanities.

Contextual information from Spring 1978 issue of Coevolution.
Excerpts from this recording were used in the 2017 documentary Look and See: A Portrait of Wendell Berry

[AJKPenguin]

A most intriguing debate, thank you for preserving it.

Kind of a related aside, if we get rid of farm subsidies, we probably can save family farms.

The subsidies only drive prices of equipment up and seemingly only benefit larger corporate farms.

We also probably need to end inheritance taxes, especially for transfers of land and farm assets to the next generations. A tax penalty should only be applied if said land and assets are not going towards agricultural development, innovation, or charity. . .and then, only apply it in extreme circumstances that can be proven beyond reasonable doubt, not simply standards for civil asset forfeiture.

Don't get me wrong, agribusiness and agricultural study has helped this world. And the innovations of farm tech have reaped great harvests.

There has to be a balance though, and the human, family element of farms needs to be a part of the future of the Farm. Similarly, land management needs to be refined and that includes making certain farms, fisheries, and forests are promoted and their land incentivized to keep them and expand them, instead of urban/suburban development.

If I ever run for public office, the 3 Fs I'll be sure to promote.

[SuperOlds]

Butz never cared a thing about the health of the nation, only about mono-cultures which as we can see now are the reason everybody eats processed food which is killing them by the droves. A 5 acre farm producing all kinds of produce is way way more efficient than a 5000 acre grain or soybean crop. I grew up in an area that produced a lot of produce in the form of vegetables and fruit. Most of that product was either sold locally or sold to buyers at a huge market who took it to major metropolitan areas. The rest of the stuff was consumed by the farmers families. My mother worked full time but still found the time to can, freeze or cure foods for the winter and the family helped. We raised a couple steers, a hog or two and we also hunted and fished. I never tasted store bought meat until later in life and obviously is wasnt near as good. Oh yeah and we also had chickens which produced eggs then we ate the old hens, best chicken you ever ate and we processed them ourselves. We did take the hogs to a neighbor smokehouse, I still remember him opening the large doors to the smokehouse and seeing all those pork bellys and hams hanging, what a smell. Lots of hard work but I think we were so fit from working and eating good food that it was much easier than people think. People who now go to gyms are no way more fit than we were, the gyms generally only help people do cosmetic training, you truly have to work hard to get in real shape. Obviously too people are turning into wimps by the use now of E-bikes which in my opinion are a joke, not everybody uses them but more and more are, its sad. Anyway, just my little opinion. I love hearing Mr. Berry speak. Butz was hired because he had a somewhat folksy way of talking but in reality he is nothing more than a high-powered attorney or politician put in place to kill the common man.