@smartchristians & @Fighting4theFaith Disagree LIVE on Infant Baptism

Corey's Channel -

Chris's Channel -

[villarrealmarta]

I was baptized as an infant, heard the gospel all my life but left the faith at 11 years old, ended up in prison by the age of 21, realized there that I had been running from my savior my whole life, came back to the church and started studying God’s word for the last 20 years. God had sowed the seed when I was a baby and it grew to maturity when I became a man.

[rolivaresro]

This is a great conversation. I like pastor Chris's teachings. I'm also interested in Lutherans doctrine. The services I watch are bible oriented. Not full of one man's experiences or boasting. The liturgy is filled with the word of God. It feels like church, holy and reverence.

[joebrinson]

Pastor Chris did a great job explaining Lutheran doctrine on infant baptism and salvation by faith alone. Thanks to Corey also for thoughtful questions.

[jayehm]

Former Reformed Baptist (20+ years) - now a confessional Lutheran.

[hyacinthbucket]

Interesting that Chris would say that the better translation of John 6:44 would be, "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me *DRAGS* him." I have often told people that God hunted me down like a bloodhound.

[josee]

So nice to see Christians having an open discussion. It is so helpful. Thank you❤

[lyssadobbins]

I come from a reformed Baptist background. In 2022, when I began attending my Lutheran church, I told myself that I like the theology except for the infant baptism! I would never believe in that. And now I am the biggest cheerleader for infant baptism! What changed my mind was reading about John the Baptist having faith in his mother’s womb. I am currently reading through the book of concord and it’s incredible. I am fully convinced of Lutheran doctrine and will be confirmed in the church on Reformation Sunday ♥️

[louisacapell]

This was fantastic. Subbed for sure!
Long time enjoyer of pirate Christian radio, and an Lcms Christian.
And as an aside, My newborn baby girl who was 3 weeks yesterday, will be baptized Sunday!

[latrice]

So God is powerful enough to save us but not “keep” us??? He gives gifts… and then takes it back? We are saved by grace alone through faith in Christ alone!

[joshuakurtenbach]

I never understand those who think people can't fall away. The Scriptures are full of warnings against it, why have those if one can't fall away?

In addition, Corey asking about how old children must be to pick things up is just wild. We have two year olds at church who speak of their love for Jesus. They were baptized and are growing up in homes where their faith is nurtured and God be praised for this!

[tulsajhawk]

Excellent and clear teaching, Pastor Chris! It took me a while when I encountered this topic a couple years ago but after careful study it was easy to see infant baptism is Scriptural. Thank you for your work! That pdf document of the church fathers was tremendously helpful for me.

[thetaliwes]

Its good that Christians can come and have a talk about such topics. Im grateful that this is not only a debate but a conversation. Thank you @Chris @Corey @bibledingers

[TadJohnson]

I get the feeling that Corey wasn’t prepared to have this conversation with a Lutheran

[Hakeem]

He fell apart with the Lydia argument...again, he posits things within the text that aren't there to anchor his point and make conclusions....you are assuming Lydia had children and that some (or maybe all) were infants.

[gogos]

If no one can come to Christ unless they are dragged by God, then how would I have the ability to undo that?

[benluklzy]

Think about this...Abraham did nothing but sleep (against his will) when God cut his covenant of circumcision with him. .God almost killed Moses for refusing to circumcise his son. .fast forward over 1500 years of history in a culture where infants were included in the promise from the beginning and if Jesus did not mean to include infants in the Kingdom, then you better believe there would be at least 2 crystal clear teachings to that effect. Jesus rebuked the disciples for hindering the children (carried in arms) from coming to him. This story is in Matthew, Mark, & Luke. If this was Jesus' intent, this narrative would have been the perfect place to change thousands of years of covenant teaching. Instead he doubles down on the fact that the Kingdom was for such as these.
Also, Naaman the leper begrudgingly went into the Jordan according to the word of Elisha only in hopes of curing his leprosy and in addition he went in a pagan who worshipped Rimmon and came out a believer in Yahweh... Jesus even testifies that Naaman would judge unbelieving Israel. There are means all over the old testament. Read Numbers 19 about the water of purification! And when Peter says "baptism saves" as an antitype of the flood...entertain this question...what was Noah and his family saved from?..the wrath of God. If you look at all the water imagery you will see it. Paul calls the Israelites going through the Red Sea a baptism...did everyone of those people keep the faith? Nope, only Moses, Aaron, Caleb, and Joshua, the rest rebelled against Yahweh and he let them die in the wilderness. Look at the OVERALL context of the whole of Scripture.

[fernandojrapodaca]

How can Ephesians 2 have anything to do with infant baptism verse 19 is clear “no longer foreigners, non citizens (the Old Testament animal sacrifices) but you are fellow citizens with the NT saints and the members of God household (12 apostle), where did infant baptism fit into the equation but another concept like the words “Catholic “.

[RosV-vndx]

I disagree with pastor Chris. Yes it is God who does the doing. But faith is the condition under which God’s saving work can be attributed to anyone. John 3:16 is clear on that. “For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son” is the saving work of God. “That whoever believes in Him would not perish” is the condition of acceptance into eternal life that is contingent upon the recipient of God’s saving work of grace. Faith is how you enter the kingdom of God, not water baptism. And I agree wit Corey and so many others that Peter’s words “for the promise belongs” refers to the promise of the Holy Spirit whom Jesus promised in John 14:16, and more so since Peter spoke this in the context of the outpouring of the Holy Spirit.

[Seekingchristdaily]

If baptism is the new circumcision like Colossians says then it’s also something done “without hands.” I think that makes it clear that the “work of God” baptism would have to refer to the baptism of the Spirit. We are baptized into Christ (Galatians 3:27)… Christ said he’d baptize with the Holy Spirit (Acts 1:5)… the Holy Spirit seals us for the day of redemption (Ephesians 4:30)

As far as physical water baptism, it has just as much value as Jewish circumcision had. Paul explains in Romans 2:

“For circumcision indeed is of value if you obey the law, but if you break the law, your circumcision becomes uncircumcision. So, if a man who is uncircumcised keeps the precepts of the law, will not his uncircumcision be regarded as circumcision? Then he who is physically uncircumcised but keeps the law will condemn you who have the written code and circumcision but break the law. For no one is a Jew who is merely one outwardly, nor is circumcision outward and physical. But a Jew is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter. His praise is not from man but from God.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭2‬:‭25‬-‭29‬

Obeying the law today would be equivalent to believing and trusting in Jesus for salvation (Romans 10:16) (John 6:28).

So whether you hold to pedo or credo baptism.. it’s not how we are saved just like physical circumcision didn’t save the Jews. Our seal is spiritual.

[benluklzy]

For those of you confused by Chris and want to know more to help understand where he is coming from read, "Has American Christianity Failed?" by Rev Bryan Wolfmueller. He also has a YouTube channel and is Lutheran. Many people have testified It is a very helpful book. There are presuppositions a Lutheran has, that take time to explain and a YouTube comment thread is really not the right place. This book should help. God bless