Nietzsche: Socrates is Ugly

#shorts #nietzsche #philosophy #lecture

[josephsuruiz]

Nietzsche dropping some diss to Socrates is wild.

[lofipooper]

We got support for ad hominem before gta 6

[Scottus-ql]

Nietzsche suffered from severe migraines, lifelong dysentery, degenerative myopia leading to total blindness in one eye, probable syphilis, severe depression, hypochondriasis, early dementia and a very weak chin. According to his own reductionist argument against Socrates, he should have been an incurable idealist.

[Josué-js]

I agree, we need to be able to only discuss ideas but not lose the ability to analyze the material conditions ideas emerge from

[filmybeing]

One who know he is ugly will always try to elevate himself through his ideas/thinking/discoveries or innovation.

[Mikesthemanb]

If there is an actual argument behind an ad hominem, it isn’t an ad hominem.

Me saying “You’re wrong because you’re ugly” is different from saying “Your ugliness is the underlying motive for your mode of thought (for the purpose of shifting value away from physical looks), therefore making your reasoning arbitrary.”

[LoneHeckler]

I'm sorry but Socrates didn't come up with the world of forms. That was Plato. Nietzsche attributes the creation of soil for Christianity to sprout from to Plato. Nietzsche held Socrates in high regard. "The great despisers are also the great reverers"

[MatthewThompson-tz]

The issue with Nietzsche's genealogical method (or any genealogical method) is that is says nothing about the claim (truth, validity, coherence, etc.) but only says something about the one making the claim. In this case, Nietzsche seems to imply that Socrates only believes ideal beauty transcends materials beauty because of his ugliness. But there is also a reverse case that could be made. It might be argued that it was perhaps only someone like Socrates, someone ugly, who could have understood that ideal beauty transcends material beauty. If we suppose Socrates is correct thus means that material beauty would have been a barrier in the way of truth.

In other words, the only way in which the genealogical method can subvert the truth of a claim is if the claim is already believed to be untrue.

It also isn't that interesting to claim that material conditions can impede or promote the ability to understand. Just ask a researcher trying to get funding, or a chemist without a microscope, or an explorer without the means to go toward the unexplored. In fact, Socrates says as much in the Republic through both his hierarchy of knowledge (image-->opinion||thought-->understanding), as well as in the Image of the Cave. One could argue - again, only supposing Socrates' claim of ideal beauty transcending material beauty (the actual truth of which is irrelevant to this refutation of Nietzsche's genealogical method) - that Socrates ugliness was one less chain keeping him imprisoned in the cave, staring at flickering shadows.

Ironically, we might say (if we believe Socrates) that Nietzsche lacked the capacity, or the power, for true understanding. Nietzsche was too weak to transcend the material world.

So to conclude, no. Ad hominem is not a valid method of argument. Neither is genealogy.

[KadOshi-po]

Nietzsche wasn't exactly a model! And beauty is relative!

[cwilliams]

There is more wisdom in your body than in your deepest philosophies

[israeladepoju]

Nietchse is Disrespecting one of the GOATS in the history of Philosophy.

[ezco]

The idea of the philosopher-king, and everything else you mentioned, is from Plato, not Socrates. And Plato didn’t have problems in the women department, and in the men department as well.

[jonathanvanhassel]

Nietzsche lived miserably and his life ended in paranoia. Socrates didn't care when he drank hemlock, he didn't write theories or any other nonsense. Plato made a mess of that and Greece fell.

[Havre_Chithra]

Socrates: Gets executed in the middle of a civil war for saying no one knows anything except for him because at least he knows that he knows nothing....

Plato (Socrates Student): Nevermind... dont kill me... FORMS AND THE GOOD!!!

[chrisoneill]

It is also worth remembering that Socrates was married with children. Nietzsche was single with lotion.

[ArjunPratapSingh-yxul]

"Mom, can we have Michael Sugrue"
"But, we already have Michael Sugrue at home.."
Michael Sugrue at home:

[superwormhalz]

i dont know. This might be nietzsche projecting the bust we have of Socrates. Is him an old man? im not sure he was ugly his whole life. i mean, wasn't he a warrior, too?

[JJG]

Ure amazing! Watched the whole thing on Gerard a while back and it was truly eye opening! Ur communication skills and ability to hold attention is incredible. About to work nightshift and binge all your lectures, hope u continue to share them!

[ich]

the realm of (true) forms is Plato mate. Socrates was a very social thinker actually.

[knivgaffelskje]

There are many other reasons to elevate the spiritual over the material other than being ugly. Nietzsche has a sharp pen but misses the point here.