EPIDEMIC: Nerdrum Students betray their Talent to become Artists — How to Reverse this Trend?

Jan-Ove Tuv, Sebastian Salvo, and Bork Nerdrum sit down to talk about the "shapeshifters" who study classical painting with Odd Nerdrum, only to knee bend to conventional contemporary art when they go out into the world on their own.

Why do these painters betray their talent and what can be done to reverse the trend?

The conversation was produced by Bork S. Nerdrum, with assistance from Aftur Nerdrum, Öde Nerdrum, and Jikke Gruwel.
The centerpiece was a 19th century reproduction of G. F. Watts' Hope. On the shelf were a Roman bust of a boy, a bust of Aristotle, and Pallas Athena.

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[anthonydimichele]

I Love this channel. I listen everyday. I am a printmaker who decided to finally to learn oil painting, which I never thought I could do. I am a beginner at the age of 70. I have always hated most modern art and wondered why painting especially seems to have fallen from grace! Reading large tomes on Modern Art is always tedious and full of abstruse bullshit about what the crap they are discussing means. The interpretations always sound grandiose but the works themselves seem stupid. This channel and many of the artists' views are like an oasis in a desert of delusion.

[emanuel_soundtrack]

14:46 on book of Anna Magdalena BAch about Bach she said he was absolutely indifferent for positive or bad reception of what he did

[phillipmurphy]

This topic reminds me of watching the transition of Cesar Santos’s work.

[emanuel_soundtrack]

This issue with the ornament at the end is very trick . If it were in other art, just do it, then you do your different copy later. All depends on the kind of contract it was. It is also stupid to just say no to some details, if you know this will give your bread tomorrow. Art is always about pleasing, you love art because it can please . There is no void between you and mankind, please both

[reillylombard]

Interesting, I recommend a read of Seneca's "On the shortness of life".

[stevechmilar]

I generally side with this philosophy and enjoy that this platform exists, but I have a question: What would happen if support for the talent to produce realism came to dominate in the coming years and suddenly we had complete reversal from what happened at the peak of the Art era? I'm not sure if a drastic increase in the amount of realism that already floods my instagram bubble would be a good thing. I mean, it gave me so much purpose to pursue realism when it was even less common than the beginning of the social media. It "makes us look good" by comparison to be surrounded by people doing finger-paintings?

[emanuel_soundtrack]

the same with the music. All my colleagues think are doing something new and valuable by imitating Berio and Cage

[dfuentesvega]

Shall we talk about the problem with Guillermo Lorca someday??

[richardhead]

Are there any classical still life and classical floral still life artists like Odd Nerdrum? I love the old Dutch masters who were doing all that floral still life work and would love to find a teacher who specializes in just this. People drawing bores me I'm a weirdo I guess. I am really driven and inspired by these classical still life works. thanks.

[dkran]

1. It would have been nice to hear the thoughts of someone who disagreed with the consensus. This was a conversation between three people who operate in an ideological echo chamber. I think that philosophizing about art has value, but if you don't expose yourself to ideas that challenge your philosophy, you run the risk of becoming a prisoner to your own opinions.

2. Maybe it's a cultural thing, but I found the drinking and smoking to be a distraction from the conversation and a bit annoying. I quickly opened up a game of Solitaire and placed the game window over the video to simply listen and avoid being visually distracted.

[markh]

Aaarrrr youth, to not starve while keeping your integrity……

[gordmacdonald]

I have thought about this subject for years. What are you willing to do to paint? Ostracism is so powerful. Even the subtle version where you watch friends and family all prosper while residing single in poverty, is too much for most. They will give up eventually to have friends, family, status and security. There is nothing wrong with that. That pressure is even stronger with the well funded kids at art schools. This doesnt even touch on being brought up within a protected bubble and no experience in a complex, sometimes violent society.
I have noticed though that even the most successful contemporary artists have a short window. Go look at old art magazines and ask, "where are they now?" Even the most successful often only have a 3-8 year window. Then what? Many Ive talked to find themselves without grants, funding, collectors or interest as they approach and pass 40, no longer the "up and coming".
Also, if you do work that is "collected" and or flipped, you could easily hear, "Slow down, we dont want to flood your/the market." Then what?
A friend told me about a conversation he had with a painter who got decent prices for his work. 1995 - 2003 he got 80K. "How many paintings do you sell every year?" my friend asked. He said, " Now I only sell one every 3 years. I filled up all my collectors." He was 45. So, 80K divided by 3 years and then divided by 50% to the gallery is only 16K/year. "Welcome to McDonalds can I help you?"
Someone once said, " You can be rich, famous or good. Pick one."

The most rewarding thing to hear is, " So, I have this collection..(eyeroll) that I dont really care about but what I want in MY HOME is very different."
Perhaps in this day and age "collections" are given to museums, public institutions or auctioned off. The art that has real meaning to the collector gets passed within families.

[graemerawthorne]

I think I've said this before but this whole 'betrayal' or 'shapeshifting' thing happens when people just assume that painting is a career. These betrayals are ALWAYS careerist decisions. Let's say for a moment that Odd's school actually is the most significant thing going on in painting today. If you leave and find that noone wants to look at what you paint it doesnt mean it's not significant, you just make a mistake to assume you will pay the bills with it. Painting is an identity before it's a career, odd is the living embodiment of that ethos in my opinion.

[coyoteblue]

If you're not either 14 or American, you have no excuse to be impressed by something as vacuous and intellectually bereft as the fountainhead.... harps on about the need for a solid philosophical grounding and then brings up Ayn Rand, the comic book version of nietzsche... just fucking embarrassing.