Why Expats rate Germany so poorly (prepare yourselves)

What is an expat? Should we stop using this term and why do expats have such a hard time in Germany? This is a complex topic which requires context which is why the video is a little longer than most of mine.

#expat #lifeabroad #germanculture

[britingermany]

TYTLE'S EXPAT TAX HELP. Check it out here - www.tytle.io (30+ countries, filings, advice, bookkeeping).

[mrinalinisrivastava]

I arrived in Germany in 1964 and attended university in Bavaria for five years. I was a young female Indian student, very shy and nervous. I had worked extremely hard studying German before I left India but arriving in Bavaria with my careful Hochdeutsch the first few weeks were extremely difficult due to people speaking Bayerisch which seemed impenetrable. On my second day at college I was in tears in the ladies’ room. A German student came in and noticing that I was upset asked me what the matter was. She spoke Hochdeutsch and when I explained that I didn’t seem to understand anyone, she burst out laughing and said: ‘Neither can I’. She came from the North of Germany.! To cut a long story short, her family became like a surrogate family, they met my own parents and very soon Bayerisch started to make sense to both of us. During these five years I made friends whom I still regard as my closest. In those years I continued wearing my sari, stayed vegetarian and a practicing Hindu. I found that so many people were fascinated by India and wanted to know about it. I tried to be a good embassador for my own culture. I made real efforts to get my German to as good a level as I could and learnt to love classical music and opera. Language is the key as it opens all manner of doors, reading and learning as much as one can about the host country, its history and literature will not only make you into a more rounded individual but a happier one.

[Korschtal]

I'm an immigrant from the UK, Germany has given me and my children opportunities we'd never have had in the UK.
The day after Brexit our German neighbours came and asked if we'd be okay and offering help. Now we are citizens and very happy here.

[torstenberlin]

Bureaucracy, housing shortage, underdeveloped digitalisation etc. - certain lacks diminish the happiness of German natives as well, me included.
Nevertheless - congratulations on another substantial and interesting Sunday video, Benjamin, and, of course, I wish you a pleasant and carefree Herbstanfang😊

[andyyygane]

I went to work in Germany aged 19 in 1985. I felt more like a Gastarbeiter than an expat! I had no choice but to learn German and integrate. Although a little difficult at first, it soon turned into a rather enjoyable experience.

[ianpulham]

Whereever you emigrate to, surrounding yourself with a circle of folk from "back home" is a massive hindrance to integration. One reason is that every second you spend using your native tongue is missed opportunity to improve your skills in your new language. I spent four years learning German before I moved to Germany so when I arrived the basics were firmly in place and I was able to hit the ground running. Upon arrival, I spent a year working in various factories before I got a job with prospects, but I used this time well.... improving my German language skills...

[JoshPadua-sy]

Hey there! I’m Brazilian, and I use both terms interchangeably. I started as an expat, studying abroad. But then, the lockdown hit, and I ended up staying longer. I got a job and thought about staying, but I never really felt like it was my culture. This was in Ireland and the UK, and I always considered myself an expat/student. Then, I moved to Morocco for work, and it was easy to say I was an expat once the project was done. After that, I moved to Spain. Again, I considered myself an expat because I met a lot of people in the same situation. But I always had my mind set on returning to Brazil. Now, I’m married and living in Germany. I don’t think of myself as an expat anymore because I moved here to live with my husband. Although I’d be happy to live there with my husband, my life is here now. I sold my car in Brazil and brought my emotional belongings. I bought a flat in Germany. I could leave Germany to somewhere else depending on what happens here with the politics, but I don’t have any trouble here. Honestly, it’s the best place I’ve ever lived. Once you know what to expect, there’s not much of a big deal. Making friends is hard, but they last. The family I have here is loyal and hassle-free. From all this living abroad experience, I’ve learned that it’s always going to be challenging. The culture of the place you live defines the points of conflict with your own culture. But there are great people everywhere, and everyone who isn’t great to you opens space for new great people to come

[stuartthorpe]

Thank you for this thoughtful and balanced presentation. I moved from England to Germany twenty years ago for love. My girlfriend was German, and I was tired of living in England. I spoke no German, had outdated and negative thoughts about Germans in general, so it was a really pleasant surprise to find that they were really decent people. Through my lover, I was introduced to her friends and soon had a network of German friends. Okay, they were educated people who spoke English, and that is important to bear in mind. To keep this short: I like the Germans. Their 'directness' was a bit of a shock to begin with, but then I was equally shocked by the dissembling, 'dishonesty' of the English culture as I saw it, having lived and worked in other countries before. In other words, I had a yardstick. If you don't care for 'direct' then avoid Israel! And by the way, forget this myth that the Germans have no sense of humour. They think the madness of Monty Python is hilarious.

[AJ-yoew]

As a New Zealander, I feel much less a foreigner here in Germany than I did in the UK

[Kkubey]

Those three main topics of friends, housing and infrastructure are also things Germans hate about the country. It's not affecting those who come from a stable and relatively wealthy family who stay in the very place they grew up in as much, but otherwise it's a growing concern.

The other thing is language - while on paper, you'd expect people to all be fluent in English and be fine with spending their private life in English, a lot of people feel exhausted by speaking English. So if you don't speak German fluently, you will likely either be among people with a similar background or lonely, not only because of the different background but also because you are seen as exhausting in the back of their heads.
I have seen expats, also German expats, who felt insulted by "having to learn a language just not to be discriminated against", but you can't expect people in their homes to abandon their culture just because you show up. Which basically brings us back to colonial times.

There is also a cultural aspect I don't fully understand, sometimes you try to converse with people and there is this wall of having nothing to talk about. My local friends share a similar background with me as well. People who moved into the city from other cities across the country in their teens and were a bit of an outcast.

[SustainableSierra]

I’d say an immigrant is someone who lives abroad with the intention of obtaining citizenship and/or permanent residency. An expat is someone who moves abroad with the intention of either returning to their passport country or moving elsewhere abroad in the future.

[Immudzen]

I came to Germany as a Master's student from the USA and then got a PhD. Honestly, making friends outside of work has not seemed to be that hard. I found a group of people playing dungeons and dragons and through them met other people and started going to the pub for things like pub quizzes and met more people etc. I do live in NRW and I have been told that is the most open and friendly area of Germany so there could be that. I have since found a job in Germany and I started working on learning German.

I have met some people that have had a very hard time integrating but they sure do make things hard for themselves. They only hang out with other people from their country or similar countries and they refuse to eat anything except the kind of food they ate in their own country. They complain about how expensive food is because they import so much stuff and they refuse to even try other options. Even when I have asked them to go to a pub quiz or a city event the answer is always no.

[Ana-Maria-Sierra]

This is the best overview and discussion of the term expat I’ve listened to. Thank you! Also, I appreciate your advice at the end. I recently viewed a video about a family from California who had moved 2 years earlier to Northern Spain. Unlike many Americans, they had begun studying Spanish as soon as they made the decision to move and once arrived they joined numerous groups and associations. They immersed themselves into football culture and took all sorts of lessons to make friends and learn vocabulary. It was absolutely delightful to hear about all of their experiences.

[arbusto]

Looking at Germany's position in the ranking, one would think it's a miserable place to be, yet the text says "64% of expats are happpy with their life in Germany, compared to 72% globally". So the glass is two thirds full and one third empty. There's room for improvement, but it's ok for a significant majority.

[Zimtbiss]

Hi from Germany! I work in a martial arts center in Berlin. We have people from all over the world among our customers. Of course the language barrier makes everything difficult for them as long as they don't make an effort to learn German. I can imagine that this is the ground on which humiliating experiences grow, too. And depending on where people come from and how long they are planning to stay my expectations of them learning our language varies.
One day, a young man of Russian-Korean origin and with US-citizenship came to us. He spoke English very well, so language wasn't that big of a problem. Most Germans speak English. But one evening, when he sat with his group, chatting after training, he told them - all Germans - that he thankfully resided in a shared apartment with other expats from Asian and African countries, which he was very happy about because he wouldn't want to live with Germans. He actually grimaced in disgust, when he said that. You could hear a pin drop. After that, I wondered why any German should make concessions to welcome and integrate him. That was such a stupid and rude thing to say.

[marinhobrandao]

Brazilian living in Berlin for 12+ years here.

I learned to call myself (and my wife and kids as well) expats as just a synonym for immigrants. I work in IT sector and migrated as you described: for a senio position with all setup by a big company. Due to that, I clearly know we are privileged people, with a wage within 10% highest paid, and a list of perks, helping to cause gentrification and so on.

On the other side, we remain having our minimalist lives, so we still take public transportation and dress second hand or as regular Joe, no expensive life style, but rather keeping our savings on real estate or investment so that one day we can FIRE.

Also, we tried to integrate early on, tried to learn German and mingle well where we are inserted. Learning the language for me has never been easy, and I'm still a B1 or B2 (depending on the context), even though my kids speak like natives. Otherwise we are well integrated, even though, as you said, Germans aren't easy to crack their bubbles. We mostly have friends who are immigrants as well, many of them from our same country.

Overall our experience has been good (except for my level of German), and let alone some few crazy people we met on the way, Germans are overall nice people that receive us well. At this point after 12 years, I see myself as local, I misse home Berlin when I'm abroad, and I have more reasons to remain living in Germany and defending it as my place than anywhere else. Even though I'd like to move somewhere South to that we get a bit more of Sun.

[raulantonioolivamunoz]

An expat does not only live outside of the original country but does not plan to locate permanently somewhere else. If you want to establish yourself in Germany or elsewhere then you are a general emigrant/immigrant, not just an expat.

[markdollery]

Interesting video! Ive lived in Germany for 34 years...I think I no longer coumt as expat, although I still have my UK Passport, and will never leave Niedersachsen.I managed to integrate very quickly, living and working only with Germans, German speakers. Here in the North, there is a hard outer crust in their personality, but once youve breached that, life can be quite nice.

[robjobism]

Indian here. Have lived in Singapore for many years, where I felt clearly a part of the immigrants community and not expats - a term that is clearly reserved for only white people living there.
In Germany, I feel that the difference between these two terms doesn't exist so much. However, here the problem is that even well meaning Germans see most immigrants of color as poor and uncivilized migrants who must be re-educated to live in the western society.

[martinhommel]

I know a Chinese Expat and his opinion is that the Ruhr is a good place for expats in Germany based on his experience of living in Munich and Muehlhein /Ruhr. He speaks perfect German and good English. In his opinion people in the Ruhr are more open because of the long history of immigration