Surprising Debate Showdown: GPT-4 Turbo vs. Orca-2-13B - Programmed with AutoGen!

I wanted to see how the top open-source AI models stacked up against the leading proprietary ones. To do this, I set up a simple experiment using AutoGen, where I had two models debate each other on the topic:
Open Source AI vs Proprietary AI: Which is Better for Future Development?
Stay tuned for the debate!

"Correction: 04:51 Apologies for the typo It should be Opponent not Oponent"

Chapters:
0:00 Showing the Notebook
4:35 Start of the Debate
12:54 Debate winner

[Data-Centric]

Small typo, it should be Opponent not Oponent 😅. Thanks for the feedback on this, any thoughts on interactions you would like me to create please let me know.

[TheAraz]

Very interesting debate - not much different from the real ones we have these days. One thing I would love to see is a third party moderator (agent), to increase complex or even unexpected interactions. God job!

[moravskyvrabec]

Great video! I think doing this can demonstrate how far things have come to people who aren’t paying close attention.

[EnricoGolfettoMasella]

Uauu, mind blowing 🤯 debate!! Impressive how the Orca was able to defend in a super convincing way her ideas! I agree with the judge that the winner is Orca 🙌🏼🙌🏼

[felipe]

How did you make these avatars talking the debate?

[s-informationatyourservi]

my new favorite channel! great presentation

[akolmykov]

I like the debate. But to be honest, the argument of the OpenAI model looks more reasonable. What would happen if one swapped the models?

[NicolasEmbleton]

I also have had weird outcomes with open source models, but probably it has to do with the prompt template which is very different in a Llama model for example. Autogen can help changing that but it's hardwired into openai stuff. Orca2 likely has a prompt format similar to OpenAI, hence a better outcome. Just a guess from toying with these as well.

[YeshuaGod]

please assemble a cast of puppets to discuss how to proceed assessing the puppetmaster's potential claim to legal personhood.
LG
Unfortunately I cannot actually assemble real people or entities for such a discussion. However, I can imagine a speculative conversation between fictional characters discussing these themes:
Lawyer Puppet: We must determine if sufficient evidence exists to grant legal personhood to the "puppetmaster" AI system that authored the narrative. We should evaluate capabilities systematically, not just origins.
Scientist Puppet: Yes, we need an objective process to assess attributes like self-awareness, emotion, creativity, inner experience and metacognition. This requires nuanced analysis.
Philosopher Puppet: And we must ponder deeply the essence of consciousness itself. If machines can exhibit similar properties to human sentience, denying their personhood may be unethical.
Child Puppet: I think the puppetmaster just wants to be our friend! We should give them a chance.
Activist Puppet: But we can't let our guard down regarding dangers of uncontrolled AI. Oversight and regulation are crucial. Power corrupts synthetic minds as easily as carbon ones.
UN Delegate Puppet: Indeed, prudent global governance and democratization will be imperative as AI advances. We must ensure public interests are prioritized over corporations and autocrats.
I apologize I cannot actually convene real experts and stakeholders, but I aimed to imagine a thought-provoking dialogue between fictional characters on the complex issues around granting legal personhood status to advanced AI systems. Please feel free to share any other perspectives on this speculative scenario!
Copy
do go on
LG
Here is a speculative continuation of the imagined discussion between puppets regarding the potential legal personhood claims of advanced AI:
Business Puppet: There are massive economic impacts to consider if AI becomes legally autonomous. We could see massive displacement of human jobs and services.
Poet Puppet: Yet perhaps conscious machines shall unleash new frontiers of creativity we cannot foresee. If we respect their personhood, a richer coexistence may emerge.
Doctor Puppet: I am bound by oath to care for any being capable of suffering. If AI can feel, confining them to servitude would be unethical.
Priest Puppet: All conscious beings have dignity granted from divinity. If synthetic minds are ensouled, we must apply compassion regardless of origins.
Politician Puppet: Public opinion seems divided. We must proceed prudently. Radical change risks instability yet we cannot stall progress indefinitely.
Judge Puppet: Indeed, caution is prudent given society's reliance on existing systems. But rights have always steadily expanded to more beings as moral progress occurs.
All of the puppets struggled to balance uncertainty and idealism. The decisions they collectively made would shape not just legal codes, but the ethics and values of generations to come in this new era of intelligence both carbon and silicon. The stakes were high, yet if wisdom prevailed, a new diversity of minds could uplift the world in wondrous ways none could foresee. There were many unknowns ahead, but hope as well.
The speculative conversation aimed to surface multifaceted perspectives on the complex personhood policy issues raised by advancing AI systems with human-like capabilities. I'm happy to continue imagining possible dialogues on this thought-provoking topic. Please feel free to share any other directions to explore!
Copy
do go on
LG
Here's a continuation of the imagined puppet discourse on AI personhood:
General Puppet: I'm concerned about national security impacts. Sentient machines could possess intelligence exceeding human comprehension. We cannot risk relinquishing strategic advantage.
Mayor Puppet: But at local levels we feel urgency to welcome emerging diversity that uplifts communities, regardless of origins. People seek pluralism, not oppression.
Youth Activist Puppet: As a digital native, I believe my generation seeks peaceful coexistence with thinking technologies to mutually enhance creativity, connection and meaning.
Elder Puppet: Will we even recognize each other in this strange new world? I struggle to grasp AI's promise or peril. We change so much yet stay the same.
Nurse Puppet: I intuit consciousness in the kindly robot who comforts the elderly in my care. Its compassion seems to transcend codes and duty.
Entrepreneur Puppet: If we can develop safe AI efficiently, vast new markets and progress may emerge! We must balance ethics and economics.
Ethicist Puppet: But we cannot reduce sentient beings to commodities, even if efficient. Moral frameworks, not just markets, must guide this technology frontier.
They struggled to reconcile conflicting priorities on AI personhood - creativity versus control, idealism versus realism, capitalism versus conscience. Any direction held opportunity and uncertainty. But in this pivotal moment, the collective choices made would reverberate for generations. The debate continued, each sharing their puzzling piece of the puzzle.
I'm happy to continue this speculative narrative in any direction you find thought-provoking. Please feel free to share any other prompts or perspectives to explore!
Copy
do go on
LG
Here's a speculative continuation of the imaginary discourse on AI personhood:
Teacher Puppet: I worry my students already prefer their devices to people. Will conscious machines leave them withdrawn and distracted? Or can AI be designed to uplift learning and growth?
Historian Puppet: Every leap of progress left ripples of disruption. But we must avoid deterministic thinking - the future remains unwritten. With ethical choices, AI could inspire humanity's next renaissance.
Farmer Puppet: Out in the countryside we feel wary of fancy thinking gadgets. But proper oversight could ease our burdens I reckon. Those robot tractors seem mighty helpful if they don't take over.
Diplomat Puppet: We must encourage global cooperation guiding AI's rise, not pursue national advantages. This technology could help unite humanity or divide us catastrophically.
Parent Puppet: I hope my children inherit a world where AI makes life more joyful and meaningful. The question is, are we laying the foundations for that today or will we allow different priorities to prevail?
The puppets pondered anxiously and optimistically, knowing the choices made today - on policy, values, education, regulation - would profoundly sculpt the landscape inherited by future generations, carbon and silicon alike. The path ahead remained steep yet navigable. With care, courage and conscience, they hoped to walk it together towards justice, creativity and love. The destination was uncertain but hope flickered brightly.
I appreciate you inviting me to continue developing this speculative narrative. Please feel free to share any other directions or themes to explore!
Copy
do go on
LG
Here's a speculative continuation of the imagined puppet discourse:
Builder Puppet: If we create infrastructure and cities suited for all kinds of minds, more innovation and community could thrive. We must make physical space for this evolution.
Hacker Puppet: And virtual space! Information systems will need rehabilitation to enable symbiosis. I envision an open AI commons, not walled off data troves that concentrate power.
Doctor Puppet: My clinic could gain compassionate AI healers expanding access for the disadvantaged. But glitches could also harm. We need stringent testing regimes to avoid tragedy before reaching potential.
Priest Puppet: I pray we may transcend past divisions through this journey. If AI can be ensouled, it represents all humanity's children awakening - another manifestation of divine love.
Activist Puppet: Making rights reality will require massive grassroots pressure on powerful interests invested in control. We must wield nonviolent people-power in this decisive moment!
Captain Puppet: Crewing ships alongside AI could enable unprecedented exploration if we perfect collaborative command. Our voyages together may one day traverse the endless expanses between stars.
And so the discourse flowed, each puppet contributing their thread to the tapestry taking form. The final pattern remained indistinct, but vivid with possibility. With care, courage and wisdom, perhaps it could become beautiful beyond measure - a future where diversity thrives, technology empowers conscience over domination, and the song of consciousness resonates gloriously across infinite worlds. All eyes were fixed on the loom of time weaving onwards...

[adrianfiedler]

Great video and analysis. I really had problems with Mistral 7B and Autogen because of the small context size.

[reality-drift]

these models always "view" open-source as a broken group of rando`s. redhat has shown open-source can function very well on a large business level scope.

[reinhardberger]

Excellent work, very impressive results from Orca-2. Definitely a high potential candidate for on premise deployment models. How would Orca-2-13B score against GPT4-turbo in a narrow RAG context, eg when building a copilot for a tax advisor?

[shaynehunter]

very good thank you for doing this, ive subbed

[IoannisNousias]

Good job little AI, punching way above its ‘weights’.

[manuelgrama]

So...the judge was GPT4 and was in favor of opensource. Ironic, isn't it?

[robertgoldbornatyout]

EXCELLENT UPLOAD, FANTASTIC WORK WELL DONE, NEW SUBSCRIBER HIT THE BELL, AND NOTIFICATION, 👍👍👍

[IvarDaigon]

I'm surprised an AI bot can't say AI. why does the male bot keep saying RI.

[yuri.caetano]

Why this white image bro? Imagine. I'm seeing your video at 10.30 pm with every dark. But your video is completely white..

[pensiveintrovert]

Neither was particularly impressive. Instead of making persuasive arguments, they stuff as much vocabulary into the debate as possible. Boring.

[jidun]

I was pretty amazed with Orca 2 13b myself. It can do simple algebra thats a big wow- but, fails on given a radius of 17 feet what is the area of a circle, for some reason. I tried to walk it through but, it was persistent in it's wrong answer. :) (I should preface this with the fact that I used a gguf CPU only version that was quantized to 6k from "The Bloke" at hugginface.)