Diesel Hydronic Heater Problems (Island Packet IP420)

I bought a cheep Chinese Hydronic Heater to try to heat water without running the engine or generator. As with most cheep ventures, it has not come without some problems.
If you like this video or find it helpful or interesting, please consider joining our Patron Crew or hit the Super Thanks button and help me pay my bar tab.

[johnnyandersson]

Have I missed something here? That heater should ramp down at 70c and the ticks of the diesel pump should be slower and slower, but it should not turn itself of. I have a completely different controller than you though.

[stubluesjhb]

Your heat exchanger is to small to take 5kw of heat transfer. My best guess

[Karl-fz]

The relays were designed to start a truck heater to defrost the truck windshield. I've seen people on YouTube put a house thermostat on the on/off switch and the temperature sensor on the area they want to control. Another Youtuber did the math and the 5kw version only puts 2kw into the water. You can add a second pump with a relay. Nice boat!

[david]

Yes, faster pumps will give less time to transfer heat. The reason why circulating pumps are generally slow running pumps. I plan on the same setup for my boat, except I plan on using it as a heater for the cabin, I’m planning on two heaters and that should solve the problem… cars have a shutoff valve for the heating system when the temperature is in its lowest setting, cars used to have valves to completely shut off the heater in the summer months, that was replaced by an electronic valve when that became possible. You should have researched the system a little bit more, some have more control over the temperature than others, some a more an off-on system. Some systems will allow the temperature to be set as low as 35c… that’s the one I plan on buying. I plan on using heat exchangers that have their own fan control and that shouldn’t transfer much heat into the cabin during the summer months and keep the loop big enough to allow more heat to transfer to the water heater… your only other option is a bigger hot water tank.

[dennisternent]

Get a Webasto Thermo 90. Best water heater you can get. And it keeps the water at around 175 degrees constantly

[garymichalski]

The relay may be the ones to let the cab blower come on to get heat in cab. Like for defroster

[ved]

Hi
I Can not see it you have expansion tank? If not bay a 5L expansiontank that will make the run more stabel.
Br
Niels

[dand]

i have also a clone but for generating hot air and is having a setting for max power and temperature, maybe there is a way to do this also. Be safe, be healty!

[paratyshow]

👍✅Oh the joys of working in the small, hot, irregular spaces that are the technical areas of sailboats! Oh but you're never there for long because everything is easy to access and repair!! 🤣

[MonkPetite]

Chinese vs the German version.
The German version will burn all diesel types of fuel but the Chinese as tendency to make more carbon deposits during the burn. Soot will form inside the burn chamber and so the heat will disappear via the exhaust.
Obviously the Germans version has way better aftersales and warranty. Next to that they are insured by Lloyd’s are a safe product. Realise that some insurance companies are not covering the copy cat products at all.
As tested by many, the Chinese copy’s are no good. Bangwood and similar brands of any type do not make the grade.

Thinker toy engineering is a thing in the usa but why challenge your expensive boat with cheep stuf installations.

The German version will modulate and run on lower settings as it measure the incoming temp vs out going.
Also you probably need a bigger expansion tank higher up. I don’t know where your engine expansion tank lives but is must be higher en be bigger than the standard engines version. The tank need to have over flow line that enables the extra pump to go allow around engine thermostat. The heater and pump can not be inline with engine and water heater. But if you look up webasto and eberspacher you will find schematics for that.

[petedebo]

How many gallons per minute does that pump push? And how many feet of hose to the engine and too the hot water tank? And back i would think that you are going need another pump from the hot water tank to the hydronic heater another thing while im thinking of it where your pump is sitting in this video that pump might be deadheading itself because of the lenght of pipe/hose it has to pump up to and wind its way though the boat to get from one end to the other end back the hydronic heater hopefully this makes sense and why i think another pump would help your situation

[dylanetaft]

If you read the manual, you have to set it to continuous mode. It'll turn on at 70 and back off at 80. Otherwise it runs for like an hour then stops. The problem is more likely the heat exchanger than the pump.

[rustygunner]

I'm trying to visualize how this is all plumbed together, does that antifreeze loop use some form of heat exchanger to transfer heat to the water, and would making that more efficient help the problem? It seems like you're getting back as much heat as you're putting out, and that suggests a heat-exchange problem. In a perfect system the fluid coming back would be stone cold.

[dhenschel]

I likely don't know all the specs of your system - but I believe they call this a heat exchange type system. Given the distance between the hydronic and tank there is a lot of heat loss to your set up. Your system would be much improved if the distance between heater and tank was reduced. Also, insulation around the hoses used to transfer the heat would help reduce the inefficiency.

[jesperbergsjo]

I have very similar unit but with a different controller. I can activate a automatic mode that will heat to 80C and then turn off the heater but keeping pump running. When it has cooled down to 60C it fires again. In my manual it is stated that power will be reduced at 70C, but that’s not the case. I have been in contact with tec support and after several mails they admitted that they copied Webasto manual but not the SW. Actually, the controller is just a timer turning the on signal on and displays data from one direction communication line charging Ming from the built in control board. My plan for the coming winter is to design my own control board with my own SW that can decrease fan and pump speed.

[markpontes]

I think your right if you move the coolant faster it won't have time to get rid of the heat.

[garthjones]

double it and add 30 after 30C double it and add 20

[JohnSmith-qiqs]

Its been forty years but thermodynamics is still the same. Heat transfer rate is proportional to the volumetric flow rate. Higher flow will transfer more heat not lower. You would be better off with a constant flow pump and the heater cycling on and off on temp. It would cycle less as the water tank heats up. If the pump IS constant flow then you need the heater to automatically restart.
Another possibility is to eliminate the hot water tank and just use the diesel heater for the bus heater only. Let the generator heat the hot water tank electrically only.

[ralphmilroy]

Hi Tim, What's the temperature of your domestic water in the water heater tank? If it's already hot, then the heat from the hydronic unit has no where to go. Next question: What is the domestic water temperature rise during one of these hydronic unit cycles? I don't think this unit has the ability to modulate, it runs at a speed to be clean and efficient, less than that would be sooty.

[damage_control_sailing]

Brother, another great, informative video...thanks!