Tropes VS. Clichés: What is the difference?

In this video we talk about the usage of the words trope, and cliche in reviews. They are thrown around a whole lot, but I want to know, what do you think? Are tropes inheritely bad? Can a cliche be good?

Twitter: @DanielBGreene
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[DanielGreeneReviews]

Am I hitting the mark here or do you disagree?

[geminidragonreads]

I love a good chosen one, or underdog story! I hate when people try to hate on these stories just because everyone else is. I'll always read those kinds of stories and will always enjoy them no matter what the crowd is doing, or thinking.

[catarinathebookworm]

I have to say Frodo might not be the only pure heartred hobbit to be able to carry the ring... we know that Sam also tried to carry it at a point and because he is devoid of interests and any evil bone in his body the ring did not affect him. They together were the force that carried the ring and not just one... but that is just my opinion. Nevertheless I completly agree. A trope normally can be and should be a really good thing. Chosen ones are pretty cool and powerful objects are also great but when badly done... well I don't enjoy them. I will do an effort to distinguish tropes and clichés better.

[mathewstormblessed]

This video falls into the "A Vs B" trope I think

[ryanratchford]

I like alot of tropes, my novel has a rag tag group of traveling adventures (all very diffrent races, abilities and personalities to oneanother)- it provides variety, diversity, more interesting character interactions and conflicts. I also have certain tropes that are the jumping off point for characters, a princess who's exploring the world for the first time- but runs into the reality of the world and has trouble with her own faith, approach to life, and mental health; a caring doctor who tries her best to make the people around her happy and healthy, sometimes to the detriment of her own health and happiness, a guy who has big aspirations of making a name for himself but is generally incompetent and has to improve, and so on.
Finding unqiue takes on tropes i find to be really interesting, it quickly grounds them in a familiar stereotype/ trope so the audience can get attached and know what they're about, but then from the word go keep exploring new asspects of how they're a unique and complex character along with the trope

[Iridescence]

Disagree that The One Ring is a "MacGuffin", its specific nature as a corrupting influence on those who touch it is actually very central to the plot of the story.

[elrilmoonweaver]

Tv Tropes is my go to source for tropes and cliches for any story I experience

[aix]

Do one on the term infodump, please! My pet peeve is that people trying to sound informed and cool throw it around meaning "I just don't like this so it must be an infodump". But infodump specifically means a lengthy, clumsily delivered, uninteresting, uncalled for piece of exposition, not simply everything that doesn't match taste.

[Remulos]

The way I explain it to people is this: Harry Potter and Luke Skywalker (in the original trilogy) are each a typical 'chosen one' but the stories they're a party of are wildly different. This is a trope. The childhood friend or brother turning out to be a bad guy is the same, regardless of what story it's in. This is a cliche.

[theretrogamer]

Even after seeing the films dozens of times, I still loved the LOTR books more than anything else I have read in the fantasy genre

[AdrianArmbruster]

I think Bright's problem/built-in defense was 'but it's in the modern daaay, that makes it original!' -- and until we get a proper Shadowrun adaptation, we're probably not going to get another Orcs-Night-Out-in-LA type story for a long while. So despite all the genre conventions played straight, it's still got a niche that can be pointed to as a "Well I'VE never seen anything like that before'' justification.

[austinmcglothlin]

I'm a writer and just now starting to work on a low fantasy novel, and it's the first one I've tried to write ever, and this video has already given me a little more confidence in my ideas. I truly feel like I have some very strong, original ideas that will work out well, but the story does revolve around a bit of a chosen one trope and has some objects of power that could be misconstrued as macguffins if taken for granted. I do not rely on either of these things, they're just meant to be some fantasy tropes to get the ball rolling, and I've never been able to part from these ideas, but thinking of them as tropes that I'm not relying on does help me feel more confident and less guilty about writing my story the way I am.

[scofield]

Tropes, when used correctly, serve as narrative shorthand. They draw upon cultural context to convey more information than a literal interpretation of the text would produce, thus circumventing the need for exposition to provide said context.

[Gigglepud]

Agreed.
I see that tropes are only bad if done badly, when someone might use it only because everyone does it, and that's when it becomes cliche. But if you understand the reasoning why that trope might need to be used, and it applies to your story, then it's definitely a good thing.
Plus, if we go by tvtropes, literally anything and everythign is a trope. Subversions are tropes. Sub-subversions are tropes. It's impossible not to have tropes in your story, anyway.

[mathsalot]

I have been asking this question forever!!!

[PartridgeQuill]

Interesting video. I tend to think "trope" is neutral, but cliche definitely has a negative connotation. I thought what Bright was trying to do had a lot of potential. They just struggled with the execution, imho. I would love to see some things that explore modern fantasy, without being strictly urban fantasy. I think Strowlers on Amazon Prime comes pretty close, especially given the low budget.

[reidwallace]

Second best Mcguffin of all time... Suitcase from pulp fiction has got to be number one, cause it makes sure we happy.

[MrWhangdoodles]

Have you read "Worth the Candle"? It's a webnovel that is and it does something very interesting. The MC is aware that he's in a fantasy world and uses tropes to his advantage. Chekhov's gun is the best one imo. It eventually devolves into a Mary Sue story but it's inside the narrative because plot armour is a cliche/trope in fantasy.

[dimovoikov]

Hello Danel! I really like your videos, and i have a question for you- Can you make a top 10 video with the most strong and powerful mages/wizards in fantasy series?

[ericrenquist]

3:23 "Because wand, because wand." That reminded me of the diner scene in Resovoir Dogs. "Toby. Toby wong. Toby wong. Tony wong, Charlie fucking Chan."