Is the Two-State Solution Still Viable?

As the war between Israel and Hamas is ongoing, the nonpartisan debate series Open to Debate in partnership with the Council on Foreign Relations is taking a closer look at one proposed solution to end the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. The two-state solution proposes a sovereign State of Palestine alongside the State of Israel and aims to address the territorial disputes, security concerns, and national aspirations of both Israelis and Palestinians. However, many have questioned whether this plan is still possible, especially during the Israel-Gaza war happening now. Those who believe it’s still possible argue that it’s the most logical path toward achieving sustainable peace and fulfilling the national self-determination rights of both Israelis and Palestinians while respecting international laws and U.N. resolutions. Those who believe it is no longer possible argue that the ongoing violence, West Bank settlement expansions, lack of trust, and failure of previous negotiation attempts such as the Oslo Accords make having both states impractical.

With this critical background, we debate the question: Is the Two-State Solution Still Viable?

This debate was recorded live on July 16, 2024, at 6 PM, at the Council on Foreign Relations, in New York City.

Arguing Yes:
Ambassador Dennis Ross, Counselor and Distinguished Fellow at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy & Mohammed Dajani Daoudi, Palestinian Peace Activist and Scholar; Founding Director of the Wasatia Academic Institute

Arguing No:
Elliott Abrams, Senior Fellow for Middle Eastern Studies at the Council on Foreign Relations & Fleur Hassan-Nahoum, Former Deputy Mayor of Jerusalem, Israel’s Special Envoy for Trade & Innovation

Emmy award-winning journalist John Donvan moderates

Timestamps:
(02:42) Dennis Ross argues that the two-state solution is still viable.
(05:47) Fleur Hassan-Nahoum argues that the two-state solution is not viable anymore.
(08:55) Mohammed Dajani Daoudi argues that the two-state solution is still viable.
(12:06) Elliott Abrams argues that the two-state solution is not viable anymore.
(17:01) Why does Dennis Ross think that the situation between Israel and Palestine could change?
(19:03) Fleur Hassan-Nahoum about the need for alternative, non-binary solutions to the issue.
(26:25) Is it possible to build liberal democracies under occupation?
(28:15) Were the Israeli and Palestinian people ever willing to accept a two-state solution?
(34:39) What if a new educational system was created in Palestine to change the existing narrative?
(38:39) Would creating a Palestinian state equate to creating a monster?
(40:05) Roya Hakakian asks whether a change in the educational system should be a part of the agenda during peace negotiations.
(44:59) Daniel Motulsky asks for examples of creative solutions that would not entail eternal wars.
(46:34) Maryum Saifee asks how viable it is to have a Jewish democracy that is equitable and secular.
(54:49) Miriam Sapiro asks about the ways to counter the threat from Iran if the two-state solution is not found.
(57:32) Debaters present their closing statements.

#opentodebate #debate #Gaza #PalestinianLeadership #conflict #JewishState #Hamas

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[NorseMythology-cz]

One of the most civil and least antagonistic debates on this subject that I have ever heard. Kudos to the panel for keeping it civil and agreeing on widely known FACTS. Not having a common basis for historical facts and a shared historical narrative is another reason why this conflict drags on and on.

[matsbern]

Dennis Ross is very good at building relations and stating common ground with people. I am amazed at his smooth creative ability when looking for possibilies.

[avaaa]

I love this debate. No shouting, calling names, etc. just pure tactful delivery of argument. What a sight to behold.

[whitneyw.]

Very good debate! All of the debaters were very good. Thank you for this content!!

[fab]

Blaming Israel for unilaterally withdrawing from Gaza is the most absurd thing in a conflict filled with absurdities.

When Israel tries to negotiate, it gets blamed for setting conditions and retaining control when their citizens get murdered. When Israel retreats without conditions and without retaining control, somehow it gets blamed.

It’s blatantly clear that this is just about blaming the Jews.

[baikorg]

“Why should we complain of their hatred for us? Eight years have they sat in the refugee camps of Gaza, and seen with their own eyes, on how we have made a homeland of the soil and the villages where they and their forefathers once lived”
-Moshe Dayan, April 19th, 1956

[johnaweiss]

"It's the occupation's fault" -- Palestinian Arabs were murdering Jews fifty years BEFORE the occupation. They were murdering Jews decades before Israel existed, decades before the Nabka. The occupation was the result of Palestinian Arab violence, not the cause of it. No wonder the Palestinian wants people to stop talking about the past -- it doesn't look good for them.

[OpentoDebate]

Timestamps:
(02:42) Dennis Ross argues that the two-state solution is still viable.
(05:47) Fleur Hassan-Nahoum argues that the two-state solution is not viable anymore.
(08:55) Mohammed Dajani Daoudi argues that the two-state solution is still viable.
(12:06) Elliott Abrams argues that the two-state solution is not viable anymore.
(17:01) Why does Dennis Ross think that the situation between Israel and Palestine could change?
(19:03) Fleur Hassan-Nahoum about the need for alternative, non-binary solutions to the issue.
(26:25) Is it possible to build liberal democracies under occupation?
(28:15) Were the Israeli and Palestinian people ever willing to accept a two-state solution?
(34:39) What if a new educational system was created in Palestine to change the existing narrative?
(38:39) Would creating a Palestinian state equate to creating a monster?
(40:05) Roya Hakakian asks whether a change in the educational system should be a part of the agenda during peace negotiations.
(44:59) Daniel Motulsky asks for examples of creative solutions that would not entail eternal wars.
(46:34) Maryum Saifee asks how viable it is to have a Jewish democracy that is equitable and secular.
(54:49) Miriam Sapiro asks about the ways to counter the threat from Iran if the two-state solution is not found.
(57:32) Debaters present their closing statements.

[avishevin]

It was never viable because one side exists solely to reject it.

[TizBaz]

Not for another 50 to 100 years, assuming re-education of Palestinian children starts now.

[YarGnawh]

This is the most civil, constructive, meaningful discussion, not a “debate”, in the world. Put this panel in a think tank for 6 months and I believe they can come to a single solution. They are level-headed, educated, reasonable and most importantly, they all want peace.

[itamarchen]

The most respectful debate i've seen on YouTube on this heated topic, or on any topic.

And I think it's because the average age of speakers was probably 70+ years old, on top of being remarkable individuals.

[stephenl]

Well done and completely civil. On several points there was consensus. The idea of establishing a moderate Muslim society seems like the way forward and would provide the evidence on the ground as a precursor to a Palestinian state. The debate also highlighted the importance of confronting the radical pan Islamists of Iran and their proxies. What should have been mentioned is how extensive this movement is. To enlarge the battlefield there are several countries currently dealing with extremist Islamists: Afghanistan,
Central African Republic, Ethiopia, Libya, Mali, Somali, Sudan, Syria, Yemen.

[ThePreityEffect]

Fantastic debate- great points by everyone.

[IimIbrohim]

This is the first time I watch a debate about israel and palestine without hatred in debaters. The Lady is a tiger and very smart.

[talmudovsky]

Three conditions for two state solution: plausibility, feasibility, viability. It seems that none of three are in the view.

[existentialvoid]

While the debate is important for the 'international community' - anyone arguing for the 2 state needs to convince the Israeli people that it is viable.
It really does not matter what anyone else thinks or who does and does not recognize whatever.
After Oct.7 - there is no one in Israel that will advocate for a 2 state solution. So a 2 state is not viable because there is no faith in it.
And that really is all that matters. . .

The future is to talk about a Jewish state with an Arab minority.
Not everyone gets a state - and I think the Palestinians have lost their chance.

Listening to Mr. Daoudi only reenforces the idea that there is absolutely no way the Israelis will allow a hostile state to form next to it. . .

[freddangbg]

I am of the opinion that a two-state isn't viable any longer. The best the Palestinians can hope for are limited self-rule on certain territories of the West Bank where the palestinians are in majority like Ramallah, Nablus, Jenin, Betlehem, Hebron. Other parts of the West Bank are Israeli territories where the Israeli-Jews are in majority like the Israeli settlements on the West Bank.

[nettalavon]

Fantastic debate with articulate, knowledgeable and courteous speakers. Thank you.

[jonnysouthjersey]

There never was a 2 state "solution". Why? well for one thing there are 2 existing Arab Palestinian States - Jordan which was illegally created by the UK out of over 78% of the land set aside by international agreement [including by the Arabs - bet you forgot that] for the re-establishment of the Jewish homeland and Gaza which Israel gave to the Arabs who now call themselves "Palestinians" in 2005. So it would be a 4 state solution. But, it is not a solution for the simple reason that the Arabs have no interest in living side by side with Israel - their goal - as stated in their founding documents and as they repeat endlessly if you bothered to listen - is the total destruction of Israel and either the death of all of the Jews in Israel [Hamas, Iran, Hezbollah, Islamic Jihad etc...] or the expulsion of every last Jew from the land [PLO/Fatah]. Until the Arab Palestinians and the rest of the Arab/Muslim world change their mind on that, there is no solution. Sorry to burst your bubble.