Angry and Red: Color as Emotion | Mark Changizi | EP 502

Jordan Peterson sits down with theorist and researcher Mark Changizi. They discuss the biological reasons for mass hysteria on the societal level, why we evolved to have color vision, and how we understand and interpret the patterns of the natural world.

Mark Changizi is a theorist aiming to grasp the ultimate foundations underlying why we think, feel, and see as we do. He attended the University of Virginia for a degree in physics and mathematics, and to the University of Maryland for a PhD in math. In 2002, he won a prestigious Sloan-Swartz Fellowship in Theoretical Neurobiology at Caltech, and in 2007, he became an assistant professor in the Department of Cognitive Science at Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute. In 2010, he took the post of Director of Human Cognition at a new research institute called 2ai Labs and also co-founded VINO Optics, which builds proprietary vein-enhancing glasses for medical personnel. He consults out of his Human Factory Lab.

He curated an exhibition and co-authored a (fourth) book — “On the Origin of Art” (2016) by Steven Pinker, Geoffrey Miller, Brian Boyd, and Mark Changizi — at MONA museum in Tasmania in 2016, illustrating his “nature-harnessing” theory on the origins of art and language.

This episode was filmed on November 22, 2024

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(0:00) Coming up
(0:30) Intro
(3:25) Hypotheses of evolution, design and the woke rejection of teleology
(14:11) The Metaphysical Club, pragmatism and perception
(19:18) Our eyes read emotional signals via blood oxygenation under the skin
(26:05) Honest signals: Why we blush
(32:13) Multipurpose evolutions, the principle driver for forward-facing eyes
(40:51) Apes and micro-niches
(42:47) The optimal language for negotiation does not require speech, confidence vs. competence
(50:57) An emergent pattern of ethos: rat play, poker, and reciprocal interaction
(1:01:35) The emergence of language as a marketplace for emotional cues
(1:03:33) There is no ledger for social capital, condensed narratives
(1:08:14) Anonymous signaling and digital identity
(1:13:21) Reading the comments, a lack of consequences polarizes the conversation
(1:18:04) Bot farms, moderation, and online criminality
(1:25:32) Broad ability to read is incredibly recent, the evolution of writing, speech, and music

// COURSES //

#JordanPeterson #JordanBPeterson #DrJordanPeterson #DrJordanBPeterson #DailyWirePlus

[jamesclemens]

Funny, to listen to the two of you speak about eyesight. My central sight of 20/800 twice legally blind, also color blind to the colors green and red. Leaves me laughing. My eyesight without a doubt, a gift and blessing, as I get a different view from most. I have first hand knowledge of our amazing ability to adapt. My peripheral eyesight is intact, it picks up color, something it is not designed to do, and it has forced me to accept or develop trust in it, that what I see with my peripheral eyesight is indeed there, as I might turn my head to use my central sight, there is more than a very good chance I will not see it. My eyesight gift, is termed Progressive Cone Dystrophy. I thank God for technology in the form of my magnifier, so I may read books. Listening to this podcast is indeed a pleasure, and I thank you so much. Keep up the great work !!! And I thank God for this beautiful life !!! Bless you all.

[edibleespresso]

JBP, you've been kicking butt at these interviews recently. Thanks for giving guests ample space to speak and share their full thoughts - we really appreciate it. I'm digging into Those Who Wrestle this week!

[HappySleepingFox]

It's a treat to simply sit back, relax and learn something new with every episode.

[cbak]

I'm praying for you Dr. Peterson.

[TheMonkeyintheMachine]

Mark is a brilliant scientist and a better person. This conversation is distilled wisdom.

[michaelthelen]

This looks great! Peterson is at his best talking neurobiology, perception, emotion and all the interwoven fields

[AlexReynard]

One of the things that blows my mind about language is that, it evolved not that long ago, but we're so damn GOOD at it. To use a specific example from my own life, one time I tried a magic-mushroom-infused chocolate bar. The physical and visual hallucinations were _intense._ And yet I'm at my keyboard, able to type the whole time and describe how insanely haywire all my body's systems are going. That seemed impossible to me. Yeah, it was as difficult as walking across a boat deck on choppy water, but _I could do it._ It was easier than _walking._ How is language that deep in us!?

[AFringedGentianToEnnien]

Dearest Dr. Peterson, I just saw your latest conversation with Piers Morgan. I cried with you. If I had been there with you I would have put my arms around you and comforted you. I’m good at comforting people. That’s my gift. The loss of your precious mum and dad won’t always hurt like it does now. Their memories will forever be for a blessing to you. I think it’s very healthy that you were able to open up a bit to Piers, and that could ease your heart a bit.
I am so keenly looking forward to the Gospels series.
Here is a gentle hug
And Ruth Anne’s love

[lookoutforchris]

No one has dropped the Mark Twain quote yet? I’m going to have to do it?

“Man is the only animal that blushes - or needs to.”

[brucehollingsworth]

Refreshing to see a articulate thoughtful disagreement that’s received and discussed

[yarongolany]

Mark Changizi is an original thinker with a truly exceptional approach. Two things particularly fascinated me about this interview: First, all of Professor Changizi's theories challenge the conventions widely accepted by most researchers. Second, none of his theories seem plausible and can easily be refuted using nothing more than simple common sense.

[gytisbl]

Oh wow. These themes are where Jordan Peterson is at his best. Psychology, emotions, perception. Simply amazing <3

[glennkings]

Sir, I grew up in Calgary during the Cuban Mistle Crisis. There were air raid sirens, timed drills for students to get home and shelters in schools. People were terrified and I recall my mother crying at one stage. What has changed? The situation seems much more dire than it was at that time, yet folks in North America seem to not even give this a thought or concern. Has mankind become so numb that this inevitability seems certain?

[susannaemmerich]

Oh wow, that was unreal, could listen to you both all day. Thank you!!!🙃

[christianolsen]

Mind blowing interesting interview! Thanks for introducing Mark Changizi to me.

[TheWEquilFamily]

Peterson Academy students here! Would love to connect with others! 👋

[PeekabooParrots]

1:13:44 I agree. IMO (about comments) people in general forget who these vitriolic comments come from. We don’t know. But they’re not from anyone that matters. Are we talking abt someone who is completely blotto or high on something or need to vent bc they can’t take it out on anyone? What’s their age, educational background or experience? There needs to be more talk about those facts . Trolling is real, but I think there’s too much emphasis put on them. Most comments are just thoughts people have that wouldn’t normally be voiced in person to your face. Maybe some would, but the majority, no. They love hiding out and getting displaced attention tho. It’s not normal, but people get away with it bc there’s no serious ramifications.

[defenstrator]

A lot of his suits of late were kind of bizarre and fun, but that one looks damn sharp.

[Veritas-TheGoader]

41:00
Forward facing seems like it is a factor in being able to predict, and become proactive instead of the rabbit reactive. It showed the ability to know what is to come without total focus on what is right in front. Is the ability to understand future.

[davidcoates]

Love JP and the guests he has. Just wanted to say how physically healthy he’s looking again. Looking good JP!