LOOP fed yagi 4 element 6 meter HY-GAIN Loop fed array

The VHF contest is coming up this weekend, so I wanted to have a good antenna on 6 meters. The Hy-Gain 6 meter 4 element loop fed array. Here is the first video of me constructing it, getting it mounted and checking out how it turned out. 6 meters is not so well in the Southeast today, but this weekend should be a smash (Hopefully).
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[DonDegidio]

Eric,
When I had my tribander down for servicing, I installed a Comet CA-52HB4 4 element 6M wide band yagi. It has less than 2.1 VSWR across the whole 6M band. Haven't made any contacts, yet. Hoping to make some during the contest. Another point is to seal all the coax to element joints. I found that liquid tape works great. Three layers gives a thick coating. The Comet is located about 9 ft above the tribander and 8 ft below a dipole made from two Hustler MO2 masts and the tri-resonator accessory for resonators on 80, 40, and 20M. All mounted on a Wilson TT45 tubular tower rotated with a Hy-gain T2X. The Comet sits about at 40 ft lowered and 55 ft when the tower is raised. Forgot to install a balun. I'm making mine out of ferrite beads and will put them on next time I lower the tower to the ground. I'm using the same radio as yours. 73 WB3BJU

[mdblack]

We (WA1SXK and W9MDB(me)) recently tuned a Cushcraft 6M4EL LFA (this exact same antenna). We were trying to tune to 50.3 primarily for FT8 work on 6 meters and ended up at 1.7 just like this video shows. We worked with the original designer of this antenna and discovered the measurements in the Cushcraft manual were wrong. We ended up at 49.5 inches on the loop (measure from center boom to outside edge of loop) and 54.25 inches on D1 (the 1st director). We did this tuning at the antenna initially with a SARK 110 analyzer to achieve zero reactance by moving the loop...then adjust resistance with D1. It was an iterative process but we now have a VSWR less then 1.1 at 50.3MHz (note that you can pick most any frequency within 200KHz or so of the center and still get < 1.1 and 50Ohms). Then we added the bead choke and 61 feet of Ultraflex 7 through an antenna switch, LPA-500, to an IC-7300 and right now shows VSWR 1.1 and +/- 300KHz to VSWR 1.5. Several things we learned....
Do not tune your 6M beam at the rig...the common mode will mess up your measurements. Also do not try and tune using VSWR -- you'll just get yourself wrapped around the antenna trying to adjust it (VSWR hides what you need to adjust).Tuning can be mostly done on the ground with the antenna tilted up and at least 3 feet off the ground. Raising the antenna further will make some small changes (like increasing the tuned frequency) which you can adjust again if you want to improve the measured VSWR. Your goal is 50Ohms, and j=0. When you add your coax and rig you will get some change since nothing is ever exactly 50Ohms plus you pick up effects of the cable...but the tuned point (j=0) should remain no matter the length of the cable if the antenna is tuned close to zero reactance and 50Ohms (VSWR < 1.1). Once you hook up your coax DO NOT ADJUST THE ANTENNA ANY MORE. Any more antenna adjustments will lie to you at the rig due to common mode effects. You already tuned the antenna. Changes in coax length will effect the non-resonant portion of the 6M band but a tuner should be able to handle that to make the rig happy. We also found that rain no longer affects the VSWR at the tuned frequency. It will affect VSWR on non-resonant frequencies. Note that resonance is J=0 and not minimum VSWR and is why you can't tune using just VSWR.

[justanotherguy]

Thank you for taking the time to put this together, especially in the rain! It never fails. You want to put together an antenna and Mother Nature has reached a decision of her own. Here are two things I question about your installation.

First, you didn't use a BALUN at the feed line and bring it down with some high-quality LMR 400. I would have purchased a ferrite 1:1 BALUN. They are inexpensive. As you know, the purpose of the BALUN is to eliminate the RF coming off of the coax and once you factor in putting on a PL259 and then using a coupler and then another PL259 you've already spent as much money as you would have on a choke BALUN and you have insertion loss that needs additional weather sealing. Another approach would be to take about 12 chokes and slide them over the coax along with a piece of heat shrink to hold them in place. you may use some black zip ties to further hold them in place. You use black to minimize UV breakdown of the zip type.

Second, remember that current flows on the outside of the conductor. You used single strand coax and simply ran a loop around a nut and bolt. For the maximum transmitted power which may seem miniscule to some but you want to use a multi stranded cable. In a strong wind and vibration that single conductor can easily snap and now you're pulling the antenna down to fix it. I would have used a crimp connector and actually soldered the wire(s) to the crimp connector. You need to weather seal them. You may have done this just to get it up in time for the VHF contest but the extra 5 minutes would have made a big difference for you with rain already striking the ground. At 50 MHz your goal is to get as much power to the transmitter as possible and as much receive down the line as possible.

I hope that these suggestions are received with the goodwill that they are intended.

[Too_Many_Hobbies_UT]

I installed the same Hy-Gain LFA4 antenna on May 1st and have been using it quite a bit since then. I was actually the first customer to get this antenna from Hy-Gain. The issue I had was the first director (2nd element from the front) was too short so I had to slide out the larger diameter piece further from the boom to make the measurements correct. I also ordered a bag of #4 hose clamps and double clamped everything. I am happy with the performance of the antenna and have powerline noise issues as well and it is VERY apparent when I rotate away from the noise. I feel the F/B ratio and low noise claims are completely valid with this antenna and I strongly recommend it. As somebody else mentioned, I would recommend re-doing your choke to make the coils side by side and see if you can do a better job of connecting the coax to the driven elements.

Nice job producing the video and sharing your experience!!!

[TheLightningStalker]

If there is another length of coax between the RXTX and the feedline that isn't there when you connect the MFJ, it will give a different reading. This is because of nodes along the cable caused by mismatch at the antenna. You can either just not worry about it or use a matching stub or some other matching scheme at the antenna. I'm no expert but that is that is the most accurate description based on what I have read.

[bigchew]

I was told by a Extra that runs a repair shop To Never Trust a Radio's SWR Meter he says they are Almost Always Wrong ! But I dono ! ! I believe him ! But To Each Their Own !

[russramirez]

The SWR is measured on the RF final side of the internal tuner, the analyzer sees just the feed impedance.

[TME]

I have the same problem with an $400 SWR meter, compared to my newer ICOM radio. I think it is the resonance the cable in between the radio and the SWR meter. I tried 2 other meters, and they both read high. I changed the cable length between the radio and the meter and I was able to make them match - not sure what is accurate however! Like to see other comments on this subject, as I have seen this more often than not at other friends setups.

[lexheath]

MFJ used to make good stuff. I've had nothing but trouble with their products in the past ten years.

[우승웅]

If your coaxial feed cable is long, attenuation by the coax may be the cause of two different SWRs measured at two different location, your Rig and ANT feed point. Because the reflected wave is attenuated by the coax during the round trip back to your rig. from 6M0MM, Woo

[tonyridlen]

Excellent video about a 6 Meter antenna set up!!! KC9QVE Gas City, Indiana

[marknormankncwt]

Are you using a new camera? Video quality is great.

[KAUPW]

Use a current balun, put the 6m beam at the bottom of the mast and the 2m at the top, increase the spacing to 1 wave length @ 2m

[robertspicer]

First I would redo your coaxial choke, the turns need to be side by side do not let the turns overlap, wind it on a round form.2 it would benefit you to put the 13b2 above the lfa and get as much separation between the two as you can.The coil is not actually a balun it simply acts as a high impeadance to keep rf from coming back down the feed line and distorting the pattern.Good luck this weekend and hope to hear you. VA6PPZ

[bills]

Put new batteries in your analyzer and recheck the standing wave, seriously.
Mine gives screwy readings when the batteries get low, sometimes even just a little low and it gets screwy.
And dude, just keep your yagis (ssb yagis) horizontal the way God intended, not some gimmicky half/half so you get "some" of both. You didn't purchase, assemble, and install an expensive high gain antenna just to half-ass the whole thing. When you have a yagi you are trying to optimize not half-ass. Dont listen to that silliness. By doing that 45 degree silliness you are compromising your performance by several dBs and much clarity and just blowing your whole intention. You're just shooting yourself in the foot and wasting your money and a damn nice antenna. If you cock it over like that you might as well just put up a 3 element horizontal yagi for SSB (which I actually use right now on 2M and does surprisingly well) and a small vertical for FM because that's basically what you're getting by compromising your high gain yagi in that way. So just leave your yagis horizontal for SSB and mount you a nice colinear vertical (if you're wanting gain) on the corner of your house for FM, a nice Comet or Diamond they work extremely well, you'll be surprised how well they work and go from there.
Good luck this weekend,
KF4PCT

[techiefan]

Have you tried more vertical separation between the VHF and 6 meter yagis? I think 10ft seperation would be the most ideal (1/2 wavelength of the lowest frequency)..

[chesty]

I have the same MFJ analyzer. I have noticed when I am around certain devices it will pick up local EMI. See is you get the same results if you ground it or move it away.

[apetercharlesstudio]

The choke balun is NOT a impedence matching device.
To match a yagi's feedpoint, you need a 1/4 wave stub, Pawsey etc.
Also, the length of the coax center conductor and shield should be as short as possible as they behave like radiators.
It is possible to achieve a 50 ohm match with a Yagi, this is needed if one desires to have maximum power transfer from source to load.

[rcelectronicsllc]

Listen for the MFJ analyser on the radio. Could be the frequency on the MFJ is not exact.

[wjwjohn]

Probably the spacing is causing your readings. If you look at the directions of your antennas they will state the stacking distance of like antennas. If memory is correct the 13b2 needs something like 9 1/2 feet between it and another 13b2. And the 6 meter antenna is probably going to need something like 11 feet. So, I wonder if your readings changed on the 13b2 after putting the 6 next to it ? Now I'm not saying you won't be able to make contacts the way you have it but the 2 antennas are differently seeing each other. There are some good websites about antenna stacking but the bottom line is do the best with what you got and have fun. 73 W0JW