Step up moving coil phono cartridge transformers

Is it better to use a MC step up transformer or rely upon your phono preamplifier's gain stage instead?

[artyfhartie]

My Supex SDT 722 is decades old and sounds superb

[dell]

I've lusted after prono cartridge step up transformers but could not bear the costs of them so I cast about for a decent DIY solution.

In 2017(?) I built the La Pacifica phono preamp from a kit that included the PCB and components. The circuitry is a couple of Jfets per channel with oil filled caps and 1/4w cheap film resistors. I replaced the resistors with Rn55's and built a regulated power supply to power a pair of them (18 v 100ma) and was very happy with the sound, I also built a Jfet add-on to boost the gain for MC cartridges. This cost me about $100 all in and took an afternoon to build, it sounds as good as you would get for $500-1000 on the open market back in 2017. This sounds much better than my Rogue RP5's built in phono stage.

It's open, has a great sound stage and very quiet, well worth that $100 and an afternoons labor..

[skip]

I wonder if there might be something to (perhaps) impedance matching that a moving coil, at least in my experience, seems to like with a matching SUT - it's not just the db gain or the quietness, - one can fool endlessly with load settings and a preamp with plenty of gain, but plug a SUT into the chain and bingo, it simply sounds like the cartridge "likes" seeing the coil of a transformer - I find all aspects to be better, dynamics, sound staging, all of that - - - obviously can't speak to more than what I'm playing with, I but I wondered for years why Art Dudley was so in love with SUT's, definitely a winner, sorry I didn't get into the game sooner - - if it matters: Audio Technica Art 1000 into their matching reference SUT 1000 into an ARC Ref3 Phono Preamp on it's lower gain setting using the 47K setting, wonderful imo - - I'm running that same set up on a second table with an Ortofon Winfeld Ti, I couldn't get the Ortofon transformer at the time, but that also seems to bring the same qualities to game. Both cartridges sound better to me with the SUT 1000's vs straight into the Ref3. Oh yeah, more cables - more money - - - bla bla bla - - - so there's that to consider too.

[scottwolf]

Just thought I'd post this from the other end of the transduction chain.
"Recently, we finished development of Amorphous C-cores application in our ribbons. Some years ago, we were the first to introduce large gap approach in building ribbon transformers and now we are the first to use AMCC's in ribbons for absolutely uncompressed high power transient transfer and, at the same time, even further improving already the best low-level performance in the world today, by decreasing the width of hysteresis compared to HF ferrite cores. For direct coupled tube SE-ribbon, we succesfuly developed 175:1 ratio, -3dB at 120kHz Amorphous C-core transformers that can carry DC idle current of SET. " RAAL
120KHz isn't really bandwidth limited.

[harrykressl]

Looking forward to the Perfect Wave Phono Preamp 👍

[keithandrewneal]

I'm still using an audio technica AT 650 silver wired transformer with my audio technica moving coil cartridge and it sounds superb. They are fetching a fortune on the second hand market so must be good.

[taloowa]

IMO, the best way to go is with 'high level' MC carts. To me, this is the best way to get the moving mass of the transducer down while providing enough juice to run a phono stage that isn't going to be swamped with noise. Now, if you need a transformer, it's hard to beat Per Lundahl with his design chops. I've known the man for about 35 years now as he makes transformers for my mic pre-amps and digital interfaces. But with Phono? IME of designing the facilities of Sterling Sound as well as being their tech director for about 16 years (that's me in the avatar setting up a Neumann VMS-80 after restoring it ca. 1998) transformers cloud up the signal more than the extra noise of bringing up the level with a good front end. But, of course, as Paul mentions, there are no accurate blanket statements! 😃

[sidesup]

The circa 1981 PS Audio IVa had a moving coil switch inside the amplifier. You had to take the top off to access it. Although it did have a switch which gave extra gain on the front panel. The moving coil stage wasn't bad, but the moving magnet stage is a good bet to be the better sounding stage in a preamplifier. So is moving magnet the way to go? In my experience No. I'm sure there are some fine high output cartridges. I am a fan of moving coil for their speed, transparency, depth and last but certainly not least; their transient response.

A moving coil step up device even if it was 100% perfect; their goes lots of sound quality down the drain from having to use an extra interconnect. If you're using a run of the mill interconnect 40 to 50% of the sound quality could be lost. If you are using a great interconnect, I still think you're going to least 15% of the sound quality. Maybe the best interconnects on the planet will lose you only single digits. That to me is the main reason why it's good to get a preamp or integrated amp with a good moving coil stage built right in. I try to avoid extra interconnects when I can, and I have real good cables.

[jm_]

Ive been messing with the Jim Hagerman head amp. I hate solid state but wo rar am impressed. Very adjustable and has very little signature. However the current quicksilver mc step up is totally alive and suprely transparent. All silver wired. Michell Cotter also of you can find one. Expressive technologies but youll jever fing one

[jm_]

I haven't found the good ones flat sounding. To me all solid state phono preamps sound flat however their quietness is very appealing

[evgenylobochevsky]

Permalloy core, high-quality, competent winding of the wire, this is the key to a good transformer . professionals know that manufacturing companies violate these principles, save materials or underestimate the importance of small details in manufacturing and offer customers either huge price obviously rubbish that does not sound

[ronpower]

I had very elaborated phono stages (incl. brands like Gryphon, ASR or Audio Research) in any case, using a high class step Up transformer, perfectly matched to a specific cartridge (in my case mainly the Ortofon SPU in various iterations, other systems as well) sounded more coherent, musical and just less artificial, compared to directly into the MC input of the phono stage. But I also had or heard many step up transformers (often the more affordable ones), that had audible limitations.

[theothercasper]

I’m fascinated by the design of that SACD player. Wouldn’t you get a lot of vibration putting the laser at the end of that long arm? 😀

[biketech]

I looked at Lundahl SUT's and some have bandwidth out to 100 KHz . Maybe some are lower, they make so many models .

[RetroView]

I have to keep fiddling with settings for a pre-amp or plug in an SUT built for the cartridge (like the DL-103) so I'll take the SUT.

[YuriKuzyk]

Great information, as always! Could there also be a difference simply due to the extra pair of interconnects required with the step-up? I've found that the choice (and length) of interconnects between turntable and phono preamp really affects the sound...

[joeythedime]

Any thoughts about a transimpedance phonostage for MC cartridges with low impedances ?

[MrNicks-gnjc]

I use a combination of low capacitance rca interconnect and parallel Vishay Dale CMF55 resistors to tailor the sound of my OM30 to get it the way I like with clarity and can just swap-in a new OM30 or OM40 if my needle goes need for moving coil for my sonic needs

[new-kids-on-the-block]

We need a nieuw diy kit from you like a phono stage of somting smaller cant you make somting fore us ?
Like if you like 2 have a diy kit from ps audio!

[NoEggu]

@2:39 "Our former genius, Darren Meyers..."

Did he fall and hit his head?