The Hard Problem of Consciousness | David Papineau & Akhandadhi Das

In this discussion we have a western philosopher and a Vedanta philosopher streaming in for a discussion on the hard problem of consciousness. The Hard problem of consciousness has been a hot topic in philosophy for centuries. In recent decades it has gained attention once again with David Chalmers coining the term and reminding philosophers of the problem. David Papineau comes from a more naturalist perspective, although he finds the term problematic, and Akhandadi is a practicing Vaishnava who comes from a Vedanta Perspective. The schools of Vedanta, Sankhya & Yoga discuss a model of consciousness and psychology which is of relevance to modern philosophy & neuroscience.

"David Papineau is a British academic philosopher, born in Como, Italy. He works as Professor of Philosophy of Science at King's College London and the City University of New York Graduate Center having previously taught for several years at Cambridge University where he was a fellow of Robinson College." He has written widely on epistemology, metaphysics and the philosophy of science and mind. His books include "For Science in the Social Sciences" (1979), "Theory and Meaning" (1990), "Reality and Representation" (1987), "Philosophical Naturalism" (1992), "Thinking about Consciousness" (2002), "Philosophical Devices" (2012), and "Knowing the Score" (2017).

Akhandadi Das is a Vaishnava theologian, philosopher of mind, BBC Thought of the Day regular, and very interested in the interaction of consciousness at all levels of reality. He has produced a YouTube series called "Atma Paradigm", and plans to produce writing on the subject.

[yadurajdas]

Theology unleashed team, specially Arjuna Prabhu, thank you so much for this endeavor. We hope to see content more often.

[daityari-haridasa]

Great. Akandhadi is an actual example of someone who knows what he's talking about and is solely dedicated to establishing consistent truths without ignoring or distorting any of the arguments the other person makes. He isn't insulting anyone or twisting words around. He's a genius, a real gentleman and realised soul, we all had the privalage of speaking with him over prasadam for Gaura-Purnima in Cardiff and heard about this debate happening.
Thanks for arranging it Arjuna!

Hearing from Akandhadi would inspire any reasonable minded person, not completely sold out to hedonistic materialism.

[FrancoisMouton-iujt]

Mr Papineau why does a brainscan show almost no activity when the subject is experiencing intense visions as a result of halluconogenics?

[ALavin-enkr]

Nothing is just one thing. It is both ‘the thing in itself’ and also how it is perceived or experienced. So consciousness as ‘the thing in itself’ is likely fundamental. As it is perceived or experienced it is felt in entities as separate and even perceived as caused by what is elemental or physical.
Likely when we understand vibration, how it proceeded from the ‘big bang’ and how it now operates, it may clarify consciousness as, if not emerging with quantum events, as mind likely does, it is fundamental to what is elemental. Consciousness not being subject to motion or to anything that is elemental is a ‘hard problem’ as all else is subject to motion and consequently to change. It plays a role while apparently not being subject to, or defined by the role it plays. Not being subject to motion is key. 
How we experience it is based on our mind which is subject to motion. That the physical brain or even the forces or electricities or electromagnetism or magnetism accounts for consciousness is more than likely not the case. This has been the perception over centuries and it is more than likely correct.

[ALavin-enkr]

Again, more than one situation prevail in relation to free will, we are also dual in that respect. We are partly instinctive, most of our physical processes are handled without our intervention, and we are instinctive as other entities are. However, as humans, as the apex of creation, are rational as well as instinctive.  
In contract to most of nature which is determined, and animal entities who operate and are guided by instinct, humans, in contrast, are not embedded in nature but stand apart from it as environment and also from the physical body so is not determined by both in all respects. We do have choice, personal choice, we do not have choice over environmental events or over others actions.

[dickramsbottom]

I always miss the first few minutes of these discussions because of the unnecessarily obnoxious noise that accompanies the countdown.

[yadurajdas]

Hare Krishna Prabhu, greetings from Mayapur. Hope you are well.

Prabhu, Would be nice to have Akhandadi Prabhu in a discussion with Dr, Bernardo Kastrup, he is a really nice interlocutor, very clear in his presentation and opens as well, this discussion could attract a good amount of people to the Chanel. And provide a good material for thought.

Bernardo Kastrup has done a good job driving off materialism, although himself a sort of idealist.

[pavankrsna]

The theme of this channel is what is most reqd in these times of quarrel n disturbance. . These dinterfaith discussions/ de ates. People

[rickyddricky]

I'm glad everyone is using my theory of consciousness. Consciousness is a geographic location of self separate from environment at a young age. Consciousness is an administrative tool that takes information compares it to memory, processes at cognitive part of the brain by conceptualizing and predicting the outcome then it takes action and that's a closed loop and it puts all this in first person view. Freewill is a side effect of it with more free parameter as information grows. Philosopher Rikard Dushi

[gabrielplattes]

Just watched that debate you had with tjump on morality. Ah, if only you were an atheist, your mind is wired right when it comes to morality... Indeed, how does he know it is objective as he claims? You pressed him well, you were on the right path... He went from noting the earth is going around the moon, and he called that subjective, and compared it to 'feelings' about killing babies... The earth going around the moon, is objective, not subjective... Morality is subjective, until shown otherwise. Morality is a dog barking at another dog, when it comes too close to its food bowl... Religious writings, are a 'set of rules', and examples to live by, writ by humans, and used to bark others in-line.

[vampireducks]

This was really poor. I could only stand to listen to 15 minutes of it before giving up. Papineau doesn't have an argument. He literally says things like: "Given that all physical events are due to physical causes (why is that a given?), you have to conclude that consciousness has to be physical" (paraphrase, 14:40). What kind of argument is that? And Akhandadhi Das has already dashed any hopes he might anything really interesting to say. He's a "Vedantic realist", he tells us; he believes the "external world" is "real". Unless he's being painfully tautological, that means he is some kind of materialist or physicalist (and so a very strange and unusual "Vedantist" indeed).

[sunshinman]

i don't understand how, therefore.... seem to sum up Akhandadhi's position precisely

[dennisheffy]

"The hard problem of consciousness". Inventing problems that do not exist, then having no evidence to support the claim.