Mass Effect 2: Legion on Brainwashing

SPOILERS etc:

This is a conversation that shows how alien the Geth are. Legion is downright incisive on topics like this. I haven't seen this particular conversation avenue anywhere else, and it shows just how complex the issue is.

Note how his lights turn orange on the word "racist" for emphasis.

It makes the decision on his loyalty quest that much harder.

[jakedge]

Shepard: "Is it really okay to brainwash them into doing the right thing?"

Legion: "It'd be racist not to."

[Crimpyiff]

"Treating every species like one's own is racist. Even benign anthropomorphism."

*everyone pulls out guns on each other*

Me: ...'kay.

[AgentW]

"Legion understood the logic of what I said, but he obviously fails to recognize that this also means that he has no sense of morality or free will as geth. No amount of intelligence will change this. He likes to think that the geth are a unique race in their own right, but no. They are machines meant to serve the quarians according to the three laws of robotics."--Agent W Shepard

[FreshestSoup]

Shepard: 'Don't apply our morals to the geth.'
Legion: 'That is logical.'
Youtube translator: 'That's awesome.'

GOOD JOB!

[marduk]

0:43
Death Watch: make sure that xenos machine is spared. what a chad.

[Promenius]

@Agent1W

"If you think you have a soul, you have a soul."

That's my stance on it. If any being, artificial or otherwise can ask itself the question about whether or not they have souls, then they have them.

But yes, it comes down to Science vs Religion once again, seeing as nobody knows what a soul really is, or if they even exist.

[viperakmal]

*"Treating every species likes one's own race is racist."*

Yet in our world if we treat other races differently. That is racist.

*"A subtlety satire"* is what I would say.
And considering that this video has been like what. 9 to 10 years old? It shows that our world in terms if racism never really that change. Nope... I don't think it changes at all.

This dialogue is gold and still gold as it is.

[ahunmaster]

Though I don't like doing Renegade options often, I felt that this one gave a very good view on how people view other races and/or species and on the emotional atmosphere that is the Mass Effect Universe.

Like Legion and (F) Shepard said, every race/species has their own view on how they do certain things. Though we should all treat each other equally, sometimes that isn't the best or right option.

[AgentW]

@lordnimr0d "The strengths of both, and the weaknesses of neither one, " so said Saren Arterius, the fallen Spectre. Well said for an organic being that took upon synthetic upgrades. I suppose that is why Reapers need organics. Funny that Saren did have a soul, but he still fought beyond the grave when Sovereign turned him into something else.
The Protheans? Well, you DO have the Collectors who serve the Reapers. They must have been spared for a higher purpose.

[superbrian]

13 years later and imho this is still the most radical thought-provoking conversation in the history of video games.

Shepard: If this was an organic race, it might be an ethical problem. Geth aren’t like organic life. Don’t apply our morality to them.

Legion: That is logical.

Tali: You agree with that?

Legion: No two species are identical. All must be judged on their own merits. Treating every species like one’s own is racist. Even benign anthropomorphism.

Legion: The minds of both forms of life can be shaped. Organics require time and effort. With synthetics, the replacement of a data file is the only requirement.

Sometimes Renegade Commander Shepard illicitly the best response!

[ReekoArch]

It's the way he addressed legion. Seeing him as "only a machine" and not a actual member of of the crew is a renegade choice.

[zzxcvb]

@StevXtreme
there are intrinsic differences between organic and synthetic thought processes, most notably organics are irrational while geth are driven by completely dispassionate logic.

[gaurangbhushan]

@Homecountry:Your right.On the suicide mission when you take out the oculus legion says:
It would appear to be terminated.Permanently.He manages to be funny and badass at the same time.

[AgentW]

@Promenius I was simply quoting what my Shepard said, (that is, Agent W).

I still can't believe that you can hack into something and control it, yet it has free will. If the Geth really do have free will, they can't be hacked. Alas, Engineers and Infiltrators do it all the time. This would have to be my strongest argument. They can talk free will all they want, but their will shall me MY will(when I hack 'em).

[dracosummoner]

I think that makes a little more sense, thanks.

[lazyeyestuffballs]

@Homecountry
I don't know if he's the best but definitely one of the best. He's the best sniper in the game though, for those who have PC version its fun to get him early and watch him own.

[AgentW]

@Homecountry I suppose I can understand now. It's kinda hard to understand the concept of biogenesis(life coming from life) in Mass Effect. How does sentient life produce and create other kinds of sentient life, mechanical or biological?
You make good points I agree with though. Only "gods" could create something equal to them, in their own image. I would suggest the Reapers but the Reapers are "Old Machines"...but who created them??? O_O

[zzxcvb]

@StevXtreme
if anyone is oversimplifying the issue, it's you. morality is a construct, so applying it to a different species, especially one with wildly different thought processes, is meaningless.

[StevXtreme]

@zzxcvb98 Morality stems from the need of sentient creatures to self-assess. Anything that has the intelligence to perceive itself as an individual (or as something definable as an "entity") has morals. Different, naturally.

Morality is a function of self-determination, it's not a construct.

[HiIeric]

@lordnimr0d Doesn't it make sense that the Collectors did some experiments on a small percentage of humans before liquidation? Besides, does it really matter?