Home Battery Storage is a Bad Financial Investment in 2024?! Octopus Energy Smart Tariffs FTW!

The dream of solar independence with a home battery sounds sweet, but is it worth the hefty price tag in 2024? In this video, we unravel the hype and unveil the harsh financial realities of home batteries, helping you avoid a potentially costly mistake.

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Join us as we explore:

The sizzling truth about costs: Dive deep into the upfront installation charges and hidden expenses that can burn a hole in your wallet.
Where's the payback? Crunch the numbers, calculate potential savings, and analyze the payback period, revealing if the battery investment pays off for your specific situation.
Beyond the hype: Hidden limitations: Understand the practical limitations of home batteries, including storage capacity, energy output, and weather dependence.
Greener alternatives you might not know about: Discover exciting, more affordable options for maximizing your solar energy and boosting your eco-impact without breaking the bank.
Future-proofing your decision: Explore the evolving landscape of home energy storage and gain insights into potential future benefits to make an informed choice.
This video is not just about bashing home batteries, it's about empowering you to make a smart, budget-friendly decision based on your unique needs and energy situation. Let's avoid FOMO, embrace financial prudence, and find the greener path that illuminates your wallet and your home!

[SimonRGates]

It will depend on your usage, for certain, and bearing in mind when we did our installation, the octopus tracker rate was averaging 36p, so predicting what prices will be in the future is not easy.

Our consumption is: 160kWh / week house, 50kWh / week car. If we didn't have solar & batteries, that would be £2300/year for the house £700 for the car @ today's 28p/kWh. We have enough batteries to provide almost all our house power, so with Intelligent Go @ 7.5p/kWh, it would instead be £600 for the house, £200 for the car. So the batteries would save us £1700/year over standard rates. VAT is meant to be lifted on batteries from next month, and this would make our battery stack cost £4200, or 2.5 years worth of savings.

Obviously there's the inverter to add, and the electricians time - the inverter & battery installation took a morning's work of the 4 day solar install, so it can't be that expensive. Say the whole thing would have cost £6000 - 3.5 years to break even. The batteries should be good for 6000 cycles / 15 years... apparently...

With solar, it's a bit trickier to work out the benefits. For 4 months of the year we run 90% on overnight rates, for 4 months of the year we run 90% on solar, and for the rest of the time I use a solar prediction to charge the batteries to make up for what we don't generate. The solar install was by far the least cost effective part of what we did, with a repayment time of 6-7 years, and of course it makes the batteries less cost effective too because you're using them less.

However, with all of that, our electricity including standing charge and export repayments, costs £300/year - over £2700/year saving, giving 5 year breakeven against 28p standard rates and VAT free battery prices.

[beebop]

That battery pack you're looking at is probably the best price I've seen on a turn key pack, wall mount or server rack. Some of these companies providing them are beginning to pick up on the larger cells and not so much lowering prices but bumping capacity. Same difference but whatever works.
That price can still be beaten but you'll have to do it yourself. Certainly not for everyone but I've got $10k invested in six battery packs providing 90kwh using 304ah EVE cells.
I do agree that more is always better when it comes to batteries. Four or five days reserve is always good for bad weather. Also providing lower depth of discharge and allowing lower C rates both in and out. All of which is extending the life of the cells. Always better on the equipment to cruise down the highway than scream around the racetrack all the time.

[Connor]

I came to a similar conclusion regarding a home battery with our solar, given we have 7p overnight import and 15p export. However the main caveat is those rates will undoubtedly change in the future and could become more favourable overnight for local storage and consumption of solar energy rather than exporting. When you're looking at 10+ years return for a home battery it's impossible to know how import and export pricing will change in that time. Also looks like 0% VAT for MCS battery only installs is being implemented soon making it much easier to go with solar now and add on a home battery in the future if the economics change to favour it

[laurencedamazer]

Totally agree with you. Fed up people saying get as much battery storage as possible. I generate 5, 000kwh, use 4, 000kwh and export 3, 500 kwh p.a. My total savings are £1, 200 p.a. with a 6kw array & a 5kwh battery (battery costs £3, 000). Battery discharge is 1, 500kwh p.a. So max. possible savings from use of battery is about £450, if all savings at peak rate. ( Unlikely, more like £250.) This ignores export savings of about £500 p.a.. If got a second 5kwh battery, £3k, lucky to save another £200. It might be viable if had the super cheap EV rates, but no EV. It really all depends on personal circumstances.

[slifox]

I brought a nickel iron battery a 12kwh at 3 grand or £250 per kWh back in 2013…

now at 2024 you can buy lithium iron phosphate batteries at £155… per kWh

The cost is coming down exponentially… probably not as the same rate as solar but much more affordable…

[OVB_NL]

We have a Powerwall and 2 EVs and are on (Intelligent) Octopus Go. Even with our EVs, 97% of all our imported electricity comes from the off-peak tariff thanks to the battery. If you don't have EVs and you have a 15kWh battery, I recon you could achieve over 80% of all electricity imports from off-peak rates (3 bed house incl one of us working from home). The battery for us has been a no-brainer. Another aspect is that since a few months ago, the solar export tariff has been increased to 15p/kWh...and our off-peak import is 7.5p/kWh. This means you can also use the battery to make some pretty decen additional revenue just by charging at night and discharging in the day when prices are high....might be worth looking at modelling this also but less certain that that will be available over the coming 10 years.

[gp]

Having Home Battery Storage (HBS) as part of my solar system has allowed me to almost cap my grid usage at 7.5p/kWh. My system is a 5.2kW solar array, 5.2kW hybrid inverter, 10.2kWh battery, and Intelligent Octopus Go tariff. I have shifted the heavier loads such as EV charging, HBS charging, and dishwasher to run between 11:30pm and 5:30am when my import rate is 7.5p/kWh. I charge my HBS to 100% every night so that I start every morning with a full HBS. My baseline consumption is between 400W and 500W, with occasional spikes during the day from the electric jug, microwave oven, toaster, oven & grill, etc. During winter days, the limited solar generation usually suffices to cover my baseline consumption, with any shortfalls being met by the HBS (as long as I'm not using multiple high power appliances at the same time, otherwise the grid kicks in at a much higher rate). On the other hand, during summer days, both my baseline consumption and spikes are met by solar generation, with the HBS remaining more than 95% charged for a greater part of the day, and all the excess solar generation being exported (currently at 15p/kWh). Thus, that way, I'm ensuring that 99% of the electricity that I import is at 7.5p/kWh, while simultaneously maximising my export payments.

[johnrush]

Great video. We are 5 years on with 10.6kw Solar Edge inverters for solar and Lux for inverters. We use Pylontech batteries for the storage, and these get mounted in a server rack. From a load shifting point of view, between march and end september/beginning of october, the batteries are used to provide power from when the sun goes down to when it comes back up. Outside of these month, we use octopus go to charge the batteries overnight and use them as much as possible during the day. This setup has kept our yearly bill to around 2k with the house consuming 14MWh. The item to remember with batteries is there is a 10 to 15% round trip loss for AC coupled or AC charged and around 8% for DC coupled (aka charged from solar). 48v makes great sense for most applications, but as has been seen with electric vehicles there is a lot of logic in higher voltage as the losses are less and the cables are thinner. Look at Fox ESS as that is using high voltage and it means the power from the panels (running at 300 odd volts DC) needs less conversion to be stored in the battery. The same is true for any AC power being pushed into the batteries.
The price on the FogStar unit is suprising. 3x US5000 5KWH batteries at the moment would be 1k each ex vat. You have to wonder what the catch is.

[fyank]

Had my PW2 installed in July and all my home consumption is now at 7.5p per kWh as is charging my EV. But the biggest advantage for me is the back up capability in a power outage. Last night we had a two hour outage and were the only house in the area with power. You can’t put a price on that and it’s the second outage we have had since install. Energy security is priceless.

[andyballard]

if you divide your 5500 KW/H annual usage by 365 it comes out at 15.07 which in theory means you would have enough in that 15.5 KW/H home battery to cover all your usage. They key seems to be if you can fully charge it during the overnight offpeak window then you have no need to load shift your bulk household electrical activities. I'm making and assumption that the installation of a battery is a lot less work than a solar array and therfore the cost for installation should be less than the £2, 500 you estimated so I could easily see a possible payback in 5 years. There is also the fact that if you moved house you could take the battery with you easily and refit it.

[peterparker]

Hi, I've only recently found your channel but have subscribed as I like your common sense approach.  

I'm in the fortunate position of having: Solar PV (5.5KW system on a due south facing roof), a Tesla Powerwall 2 battery (13.5KWh of storage), a Zappi EV charger (charge the car on sunshine in brighter weather) and an electric car BMW i3 Range Extender. I've had this set-up since July 2018, so a good period of time to get plenty of experience this the system.
I'm on Octopus Intelligent Go tariff, which either fills the car battery up overnight when needed or fills the Tesla Storage battery up, if the Powerwall thinks the weather for the day ahead isn't going to be favourable.  
Obviously in the summer months there's an abundance of energy being generated from the solar roof and the Powerwall 2 is often completely filled by Solar electricity long before midday.
However, in the darker months (winter) with the limited solar generation and the Tesla battery filling up with low priced electricity overnight, we can go for most of the day on the stored (cheap) electricity but we cannot make it through the entire day without drawing some of the more expensive electricity from the grid. Therefore, if you do consider going with battery storage I can understand why people are saying to get as much storage capacity as you can afford.
I'd love a 2nd Powerwall 2 but even with the 0 Vat at the moment it's still quite an investment. It would mean however, that we could use nothing but low cost electricity all year round.
The other thing to consider that will become commonplace, probably within the next 12-18 months, are EV's with 'Vehicle to Home' and 'Vehicle to Grid' becoming more widespread. The question then becomes do I invest in static battery storage or in an EV that can provide battery storage when not being driven around!

[hyweljthomas]

I have a 9.5 Givenergy battery and no solar or EV and, with a switch to Agile, save around £100 a month - a 4 year payback. Our previous cost per kWh on Flexible was 27p, in the past 4 months it has dropped to around 11p. This may creep up with higher Agile prices and lower summer use, but I would be very surprised if payback was more than 5 years.

[edwardwilcox]

Have you allowed for the electricity price inflation. Even 1% inflation is significant due to compounding. I calculated my FIT solar payback times as 10 years, but it turned out to be 7.

[geoffreycoan]

Agree you need to do calculations like this. My own spreadsheet on adding a 3rd battery gives a payback of 5-22 years depending on different assumptions! Your spreadsheet didn’t seem to cover the scenario of self consumption of the solar and storing self generation to use later - this is the best use of a battery but of course predominately summer.
Few things to highlight:
- multiple GivEnergy batteries don’t increase charge/discharge rate, the inverter sees them as a single large battery🙁
- look at depth of discharge. The GivEnergy 5.2 is 80% so only 4.2 usable 😣
- likely you’ll need the cost of an inverter to make use of these batteries unless you get a hybrid
- for Octopus Go you do need an EV (or one on order)
- Tracker rates are not guaranteed, they can go up substantially, and if leave Tracker you can’t go back for 9 months. Part of the reason I didn’t go onto Tracker for the winter

[simonperkins]

I started my journey in 2011 with solar panels 2016 Nissan leaf came along 2022 battery storage 9.5 kw givenergy 2023 A2A heat pump Gas was disconnected.
2024 I hope to install a IHP Mixergy hot water tank and maybe another 9.5 battery and move onto octopus intelligent what a journey i am enjoying every minute of it.😊

[christopheredmondson]

Thank you for a very good video, I'm in total agreement, all the quotes I received included batteries, £4000 for two 5.2Kw batteries with the Octopus quote, I couldn't see how the figures would add up with my annual electricity consumption of 3500Kw, I have no plans for an electric car, or moving away from gas central heating and hot water, although we may choose to change our cooker from gas to electricity in the future, we are both retired, so are mainly at home during the day. Battery storage may be a good option for people not at home during the day. My planned 6.12Kw system has an estimated payback of 7 years and 6 months, the payback would be at least double if I had included batteries which is about the length of the battery's lifespan. It seems that the cost of batteries will continue to reduce and no doubt the performance will improve, I will keep an eye on battery storage for the future, but at this time, it's not for me.

[angusgeorge]

Hi I have 6.5kwp panels and 16khw battery and 1 EV for 9 months and 1 for 6 months and we imported 3000kwh for 2023 on OG and IOG both had the cheap rate of 7.5p and we used 95-99 % on cheap rate. The average price per unit was 10p ish.

[simon]

The fogstar looks like an off grid option. Check the output is 230v, or you'll need a hefty inverter to get it from 48v, probably some Victron jobs.

[williamlabarre]

Excellent analysis. While we on the other side of the pond have different supply and rate structures, most are similar, so your approach to this work is quite useful.
However, one dimension to consider when looking at storage is energy security. Depending on the quality of your source and/or the perhaps seasonal or storm effects, storage can be cheap at any price. But then you have to consider storage capacity vs. demand to compare to possible long-term (as defined by the analyst) needs.

[seatonian]

A lot of great content in the video and, equally, some good points already in the comments.

There are many intangibles and 'what ifs' already raised and, although I appreciate it only serves to muddy the waters further, here's another one :)

- (some) dependency away from the grid.

There are any number of reports that predict increasing power outages. Admittedly, some of them are probably self-serving by promoters (both direct and indirect) of alternative energy solutions but losing power is at best an inconvenience but can also be much more serious and costly.

By having your own in-house electricity store, you can help mitigate the impact of power outages. What that is worth to you - or anyone else - is very much an individual thing and probably quite difficult to put a £ value on. (You may also need to factor in costs to provide 'protected' circuits. I did say it would complicate things further!! :) )