A.C. Grayling - How Belief Systems Work

Why are 'belief systems' so powerful? How do they control religion and politics and all ways of thinking from a scientific worldview to conspiracy theories? What is a 'belief system'? It is a set of tenets or convictions that support each other, such that the whole system governs individual beliefs. How we believe may be more important than what we believe.



Anthony Clifford Grayling is an English philosopher who founded and became the first Master of New College of the Humanities, an independent undergraduate college in London.


Closer to Truth, hosted by Robert Lawrence Kuhn and directed by Peter Getzels, presents the world’s greatest thinkers exploring humanity’s deepest questions. Discover fundamental issues of existence. Engage new and diverse ways of thinking. Appreciate intense debates. Share your own opinions. Seek your own answers.

[rscpeace]

Very thought-provoking discussion about a topic that I care about and enjoy learning more. I was one of those brought up in a very orthodox religious environment but was fortunate to be educated in science up to my Ph.D. That changed everything over the years and I have deprogrammed to be an Agnostic

[derektrudelle]

Belief is what is accepted into the mind as true. Its starting point is the instability of perception. Of all of these perceptions, which are true, asks the mind.

A fundamental premise, accepted as true, establishes a system of belief.

Ex:
Am I a body?
Yes.
Then my brain must be the source of consciousness.
And
I will some day cease to be because bodies are born and bodies die.
And
This body needs protection from other bodies.
And
This body is on a journey because it exists in time. Since I am this body, the journey is the hero's journey because it involves me, a separate body, who must face other bodies in the hunt for comfort and power. If I am not the hero, then I must be the conquered.

And so on.

The acceptance of subsequent beliefs are based on the first belief that you are a body. Without the willingness to question, the belief stays fixed in the mind.

[wolfeyes]

Something i think you should look into is control, manipulation, neuroliguistics, body language, suggestion etc because those things will also help people to understand beliefs.

A great many, if not all of these things exist in religion and hence why, once people become believers, it is difficult for them not to!
Written words can also be structured in such a way as to manipulate people and their beliefs.

[andreasplosky]

Always good to hear a voice of reason once in a while, instead of the theistic fantasists we get so regularly on here.

[LawrenceFache-rvwi]

Any belief system works with focus, intent and individual willpower. Human nature tends to want to define belief systems with visual aids and agreement. Both help focus the inner determination. The challenge, is to not suppose any belief system is correct except your own. The problem is discarding the tendency to adopt someone else's description or expression. Both Science and Religion are stonewalled against each other, because no matter the facts on either side, belief only needs the support of desire and choice. With no facts to support the decision other than because we want to. This makes noise and a market out of every conversation or disagreement. We argue over contradictions in literature or practice that should undermine beliefs, but it does not. Because belief, even irrational beliefs cannot be taken away. They become life support for the shared delusions. An aspect of herd mentality.

[merrybolton]

Good to hear someone talking sense for a change

[MrSanford]

What all beliefs systems share in common-is that they all speak of a future that is perpetually in a state of arriving but never arrived. And all belief ends at death and thus the existence of perpetual certainty. This is one of the reasons why I believe in life after death because certainty is probably the ultimate purpose of reality, and Nature wouldn’t leave us with an eternal question…..

[ptgms]

From my understanding Mao Zedong's mother, Wen Qimei was a devout Buddhist, as well as, Mao having been raised in a devout Buddhist environment and at a very young age became a Buddhist himself early on in life...? It also seems some of his nearest family was killed by enemies that opposed his doctrines later in life. In some similarity of another dysfunctional belief system, Hitler went to the Glade of the Armistice to humiliate the French in Foch's private train in which the Armistice of 11 November 1918 was signed. There always seems to be an escalation of ruthlessness during any war during opposing beliefs. I had to look it up again to remember who mentioned the quote, but in addition to this, I have trouble imaging what it would be like to command an army going into war for any beliefs... wealth, territory and power over other humans. I just could not psychologically do this, anyway, the quote: “War is cruelty. There is no use trying to reform it. The crueler it is, the sooner it will be over.” – William Tecumseh Sherman. I am sure other leaders throughout time and during conflict, [particularly Hitler] have realized this too in their own madness.

[Ekam-Sat]

Truth lies beyond belief. - Wald Wassermann

[Jack-hudo]

I agree that this was a thought-provoking discussion. And I also agree that many religious believers can become impervious to challenges to their belief system. But this certainly isn't the case with all who hold religious beliefs. William Lane Craig recently appeared on Closer To Truth, and his breadth of research certainly could have destroyed his belief in God. But, in fact, it has had the opposite impact. I would also say that scientists are not exempt from the argument used against religious people. Many scientists go beyond methodological naturalism and embrace philosophical naturalism, which is a world view in the same category as the theistic world view (both are faith-based). A scientist's philosophical naturalism (matter and energy are all there is) would never allow a creator--by definition.

[TheWayofFairness]

Punishment for unfairness and reward for fairness. Everything else is unfairness.

[JamesRichardWiley]

A true belief is reliable, testable and provides consistent, predictable results.
Religion only requires faith without testing for reliability.

[stPrinciples]

How does it work? Actually, as always, the answer is, we don't really know. We BELIEVE we know only

[andygoldensixties]

I think that the relation between Religion and Politics is more complex. Chinese Communism cannot be entirely understood without considering it's relation with another belif system such as Confucianism - by the way, a non theistic culture. As to Italy, it's true that the Churh fought hard against Communism, but in common people's experience there was a more subtle mutual influence betwee the two ideologies.

[jessicamaynard]

Religion to me is energy there's just different rituals but one thing remains

[JungleJargon]

It’s not about religion. It’s about what the absolute truth is. I believe what is absolutely verifiable. Mindless matter and energy cannot make or direct themselves. An infinite regress of physical causes is irrational unscientific and nonsensical. Biology programming itself is no different. Biology reprogramming itself is no different. Naturalism is no different.

[babyl-on]

I distinguish between "Western religion" (there is really only one Western "religion" as all the sects worship the same power of their god above all else and especially human life) and the spiritual practices of the East which do not worship power as more sacred than human life. The spiritual practices of the East are not "religions." To me there are huge differences between the two. While they do share the characteristics of "belief systems" one elevates the power of a supernatural being to the ultimate exalted position of power over all human life while the other values human life above all else. While both are "systems" one demands domination over human life by the "god"(read power) while the other does not recognize the supernatural as ruling our lives or even recognize the supernatural at all. Religions are no different from other human institutions, they were created by human beings for the purpose of controlling and dominating and having the power of life and death over all humanity. god = power over human life and that power is what is sacred and holy not life itself.

[علي-شثب]

-*How has A.C. Grayling become a philosopher?*
-*Faith*

[getayalewe]

Many atheists say we don't have a religion, but whatever we believe in is a religion. But someone else knows how true what we believe is. Belief is associated with truth or falsity. A person can be said to have true faith only if what he believes has an eternal reality. Because it is not enough to just believe, it is necessary to know whether the belief we believe is connected to the truth reality For example, scientists are divided in their opinion about the existence of God, that is, about half of scientists believe in a creator, while half do not believe in a creator. These scientists are 100% the same in their scientific opinion, but they differ in the level of belief because they both believe that they have their own reality. There are those who believe that there is a creator or not, but only the creator knows the true believer. One who stands with the truth believes in the existence of a creator and knows, but one who does not stand with the truth denies that there is a creator. So the important thing is to come to the truth in order to have true faith.
Because only reality reveals true belief, we cannot find true belief unless we first come to reality, reason, the belief in which the creator is only found when we reach reality. Jesus said truth shall set you free from a false beliefs system. it does not matter what religion background you have.

[grijzekijker]

Mat.10: 36 "And a man's foes shall be they of his own household"