Weird Medieval Weapons: Tod's Hilted Pollaxe Sword Thing!

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[tlsgrz]

"You might have disarmed me of my Pollaxe sire, but but have you considered this?"
*pulls out second, smaller pollaxe*

[tods_workshop]

Thanks Matt, great thinking and analysis here and I think your idea of a tournament weapon could well be it. For me the weight and the short length makes it unlikely to be a battle field weapon and so thanks Matt for those insights. The hook is interesting because it is close to the COG and that (in my opinion) makes it really unsuitable for suspension, but as you say if it was a trapping hook it is also sub-optimal and why not have two? So basically neither option is entirely satisfactory. Anyway thanks for making the film and I look forward to getting some of you guys to spar with them.

[caioabramo]

Not theories but some not-too-far-fetched possibilities:
- Masterpieces made for admission as a Master in a Guild (alternatively, "journeyman pieces" [Gesellenstück])
- Presentation pieces made for a noble or high official, perhaps even from weapon's makers guilds.
- Commissioned by a noble or military official as research, potentially from two different makers; would this be an effective weapon? Let's try out. Here are the specs. Poleaxe makers think "odd as all f***, but you're the boss...".
- Commissioned as potential unique weapons for a section of honour- or bodyguards (again, maybe from two+ smiths).
- Made for a special tournament, display or presentation of warriors, and thus with a novelty/entertainment spin.
- Gag gift from a noble to another.
- Just a regular poleaxe, but designed by a committee.
- Aliens.

[SirBlade]

Maybe someone was challenged to a poleaxe duel and wanted a weapon that was technically a poleaxe but which allowed him to use his longsword training.

[Rocknjax]

The fact that there's two of them, nearly identical, thinking they were made for a tournament or a duel makes sense.

[ModernKnight]

Really interesting idea about them being a pair made for a specific type of specialised 'sporting' tournament combat. That fits will with the odd special fights they were having and specialised rules sets in the C16th. We know some rules were very specific about armour and weapons.

[GaryDunion]

I'm pretty convinced by Matt's theory that these are tournament weapons, however _if_ it was a battlefield weapon, one potential use does occur to me, which is as a portable poleaxe for mounted knights.

As I understand it, the typical weapon set for a mounted knight was lance, sword and dagger. If he was unhorsed, he would be fighting as a foot knight with a sword - a perfectly serviceable weapon but not as effective as a poleaxe for armoured fighting (which is why dedicated foot knights of the period used the latter).

A mounted knight couldn't carry a full size poleaxe but he could have worn one of these, and maybe even somewhat used it from horseback, but most importantly should his horse fall he would have had immediate access to something he might feel was a superior weapon in the circumstances than the standard longsword.

[DETHMOKIL]

My theory about the "sword catcher" tab, its for displaying them in a pair like crossed swords.

It just reminds me of 'rifle stacking swivels and rods' on the front ends of old military rifles, used for keeping the guns from laying in the dirt by making a free standing tripod. The fact that there two of them and they are identical would lend to this super specialized use. If they were judicial dueling weapons then they would probably spend their lives mostly sitting around waiting to be used. It sure would be a dramatic thing to see on a wall, and maybe reinforce the idea that maybe you don't want to mess with a guy so well equip to fight in duels with strange brutal looking weapons.

Maybe when Todd brings by his pair of sparing ones you can try to hook them together?

[Anti_Woke]

"Tournament weapon": expression used while "ceremonial" is on holiday

[chrisball]

If it was from Henry VIII's collection, then he might have just bought it out of sheer curiosity. Some of the other stuff from his personal collection is really unorthodox and potentially impractical- e.g. the spectacled helmet in the Royal Armories and the 'holy water sprinklers' and 'gun shields' in the Tower of London. He paid German armourers to relocate to Greenwich and work for him, because he was that much of an aficionado or arms and armour. There's every chance he'd buy something just because it was weird and he hadn't seen it before, and if he was buying one, he'd probably want another so he could spar with it.

[evilwelshman]

On there being two of them, you forgot to consider a third possibility.... perhaps it's the work of *_TWO_* drunken blacksmiths on a Saturday night (or alternatively, one drunken blacksmith on two Saturday nights). 😁😁

[CrimeVid]

Maybe the hook/blade catcher/ belt hook thingy is meant to interlock with the Royal Armoury’s one and stand against something else as part of a “fantasy weapons “ display ! but I still think it is part of some sort of parade equipment.

[davideddy]

If there are only two survivors and they were most likely used for tournament, is it possible that the hooks were added later as a way of displaying the pieces? Tod mentioned that the original might have been made out of wrought, given how much it bent when you swung this mild steel one it makes sense to me that whoever commissioned them might not have had the best luck in tourney but might still have wanted to show them off afterward because they look neat.

[andrewholdaway]

I like to think of it as a product of Henry's top secret experimental weapons division.

[MacDorsai]

There is a saying, "Mission determines the gear". In other words, before you choose your gear, which includes weapons, first know and understand the mission, i.e. what do you want them to do. The converse is "Gear defines the Mission". That version can serve as a tool to determining what the weapon was designed to do.
The grip and cross guard look like they come off a longsword or even a Zweihander. The shaft and head are definitely in the warhammer/polearm genre, and it was designed to fight someone in armor. One of the things I've observed in the manuals and in videos of armored fighting, is that use of a longsword against armored opponents is the use as a grappling tool. So here is my theory. The grip, long crossguards, and the shaft are designed to assist in grappling and leveraging your opponent for a takedown. Unlike the longsword which would primarily use the point for half-swording into gaps in the armor. This weapon isn't designed for thrusting, it is used for smashing and penetrating with the point via the heavy swings, not thrusts.
And I agree with the belt hook. I've seen old pistols with a similar design.

[Stigstigster]

Watching Matt move in such a fluid way whilst wielding sword or polearm is fascinating and most impressive. Almost like a very lethal dancer. You don't learn to move like that in just a few hours that's for sure.

[CornsilkSW]

Given the shape and style, the Zweihammer seems like a fitting moniker.

[ddimoulis]

I do like the rule-set theory. If a tournament is designed around measuring one`s skill level at wielding a particular weapon in a harness, then it makes absolute sense that any feature that would make the general tendency harnessed fighting has to descend into grappling viable not desirable. The barrier hypothesis is particularly attractive if interpreted in this manner. The butt end would also be conducive to closing in between fighters. The question, then, would be why were they made that heavy - if I recall correctly, safety becomes a central issue in the 16th century tournaments and that thing hits like a bloody truck.

[ninekings]

It looks like its more of a specialized war hammer to me, Based on its looks: spiked hammer face, a hook/spike opposite the hammer face, and thrusting spike at the end. The first thing jumps into my head is this is for combat in enclosed areas like rooms against armored opponents. possibly a siege/breaching/dueling hammer...

[guybucknell]

Just want to take a second to admire that the poleaxe that you possess that you compared this strange weapon to is absolutely beautiful. What a poleaxe mmph 👌