Is a BAN on Home Batteries in Lofts Coming?

This video looks at new guidance in the UK about where home batteries should be installed. Loft installations are very much not favoured!

The new guidance of UK home battery installation:

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#battery #loft #ban

[fyrfytrdub]

I am a firefighter. When faced with the decision on where to install my set up the loft was the logical solution. No outside space was appropriate and utility room directly under stairs so in the event of a fire that'd compromise primary means of escape. Batteries and Inverter are on a block wall on the opposite side to my neighbours house. Also they're LFP batteries. Like everything it's a risk v benefit situation. There's also a hard wired linked smoke alarm system in the attic which is well ventilated. I'd be more worried about my kitchen and laundry appliances to be honest

[artisanelectrics]

I did an Instagram live session about this a few days ago to raise awareness among installers, unfortunately most installers are completely oblivious to this new guidance. Thanks for your video.

[johnwarwick]

Personally I believe it to be a sound decision. Lofts are also the worst place for inverters, way too hot in summer. As an industrial electrician for 40 years I can tell you nothing kills inverters faster than heat. Battery enclosures are available for outside fitting and hopefully these will be improved following this decision. High power batteries have no place in an un occupied very dry mainly flammable location that could well have an ambient temp of 40 deg plus in summer. Sure as hell wouldn’t have them in my loft, luckily I have the space and have build a totally non flammable small outbuilding for them

[shaffermarkshaffer]

Gary, your last point on battery chemistry is the elephant in the room. LFP batteries are inherently stable. I am a London based installer and this is likely to render many homes unable to use the technology. I called the major battery manufacturer's tech support lines today. Not a single UK event in which the cells ignited came to light. One manufacturer told me that they had a battery fire due to water ingress causing a short on the PCB. The LFP cells did not ignite. I suspect that this advice is somewhat knee-jerk in nature and is more about the fire service reacting to fires in the transport sector and not understanding the chemistry?

[jabberwockytdi]

Look at this way, we didn't ban the use of gas appliances within the home, we developed ways to manage the risk to an acceptable level. Gas explosions still happen now and then, almost always because regulations and maintenance were ignored, but we continue to accept the small residual risk for the benefit of using gas as a domestic fuel.

[michaeldepodesta]

Thank your for your balanced presentation. Presumably this calls for a specification of batteries as 'loft-safe' i.e. guaranteed to not start a fire. If batteries can be used (inside a fireproof box) in safety critical applications such as on a Dreamliner, then surely they can be used in a home in a fire-proof box.

The specifications look to me to be overcautious. They remind me of the noise specifications for heat pumps which don't apply to boilers.e. there is a burden on new technologies to perfect whereas old technologies are insanely more dangerous: For example we allow people to set light to bare gas outlets in their kitchen. Why is there no talk of banning that?

[simonm]

The home insurance issue is interesting. I have had home batteries since 2020 and my insurers are not aware of them, or my solar panels or my ASHP or my EV. When applying for home insurance, certain questions are asked regarding items which affect risk - what door / window locks do you have, are you in a flood area etc. I was never asked about my home energy modifications. My opinion is that if the company does not ask about a specific item then they do not consider it risk influencing so are not concerned. They don’t ask if I have an open fire, gas boiler or pottery kiln either. I wonder if this will change going forward? Thoughts?

[michaelridley]

Would really like to see more of the evidence underpinning the new guidance. How many instances of home-battery related fires have there been, and what analysis has been done of the causes in coming up with these new recommendations? Presumably with the number of home installations out there now, if the level of risk was significant we would be seeing a non-neglible number of fires. If not I have questions as to whether the proposed approach is actually proportionate...

[garysmall]

I was all set to install my GivEnergy system on the end wall of my end of terrace loft. Fortunately I already had a lean-to well ventilated shed on the ground floor on the other side of the same end wall. And this seemed the safer/logical place to install giving easier access for any upgrade and maintenance. And two weeks on I have just seen your post. Also managed to get the IOF tariff up and running, So happy days!! Thanks for all your very informative posts. G

[pamvince]

Hello thanks for your videos - such excellent reference points for helping me get onto the solar energy ownership. I have a recent quote and the survey told me that the battery will be outside - this pleased me as I always thought the loft not suitable. However the best place for my batteries are near the meter on my drive which is okay but it is not really secure. I was also told that a canopy isn't really needed either so do you have any directives of how best to install the batteries. i.e. should it be in a ventilated housing etc?

[normanboyes]

Thank you for posting this just a few points for what it is worth.
1. This is not a British Standard yet - at this stage it is a Proposed Amendment to the Standard (PAS) - however it will be likely be incorporated into a standard.
2. Although it is setting out to drive towards installation external to the dwelling it does recognise this is not always practicable.
3. Where they have to be installed in a dwelling it is recommending risk reduction measures.
4. Worth mentioning it is not just loft or under stairs installations - it captures integral garages too!

[TypeRhino]

We are GivEnergy approved installer. The don’t want battery above a 5.2 in the attic so we don’t. When we do we always fit loft boards so if they do fall the boards are there. We use fire proof boards if a gable wall is not available. Also we always install smoke alarm. This study as said does not take into consideration lfp batteries it is based lithium iron. I know not all installers do these things so it good that some guidance is available but it needs to be up to date

[steve_]

I've just noticed 6.5.7 - If I am reading it right they are limiting home storage to 80kWh if in a garage/outbuild or 40kWh if in a house?
I know 40 or 80 kWh is a lot of storage but seems an odd limit to have when cars can have 100kWh or more and be parked in the same garage?

[timtam]

I was told by an electrician that if a fire is going to start, I want it to be in a place I might see or smell it first. He always advises against anything in a upper floor or loft

[vorpalteaspoon]

Thank you for this video. About to get a system installed in a bungalow, with batteries in the loft. But, the loft has ventilation, so I'm slightly reassured by your picking through the wording. The long-term concern would be the impact on house saleability if it becomes a standard - many households might have this set up.

[TimHodgesofEdinburgh]

I had my solar system installed in 2018. Installer pushed really hard to place the inverter in the loft. They said it would have issues being outside whilst I think they just wanted to save money on cable. I had to get quite belligerent to get it placed outside. I had checked with Solaredge that its location under a canopy would be fine. I think in Australia they have to go outside too. My main reasons were not wanting a hot box of electronics in a hot loft on a sunny day esp as my array is oversized and if the fire service ever need to put out a fire in my house they’ll probably want the inverter turned off first. Difficult if it’s in the loft.

[edc]

Don't run any electronics in your (uninsulated) loft, I went through a few network switches as they were being baked to 60*C in the summer

[comahon]

I’m thinking about installing a home battery and a heat pump. This update has definitely opened my eyes to the placement of the battery. As our house is a mid terraced town house the safest option would be to install the battery outside. Possible house it in some sort of cabinet. I guess they’ll be a lot of companies offering external cabinets for these home batteries now.

[Trenchfoot]

I think there's a few issues to consider here. Firstly, even if a PAS is converted to a British Standard, that doesn't make it law, it's still guidance. However, your house insurance, for e.g., may stipulate that an installation be to the appropriate BS and may be invalid if it isn't.

Secondly, smoke detectors in lofts are generally not a great idea as they also tend to be fairly dusty spaces, and this can lead to excessive false alarms. Swapping to heat detector heads then considerably reduces the sensitivity and effectiveness of your system.

Thirdly, any fire in your loft space tends to spread pretty quickly laterally, especially with the heat release rate characteristics of lithium batteries and is difficult to firefight in the initial stages (becoming much easier once your roof has collapsed in and the ALP has access). However, once the ALP has access, it's likely that no other part of your house will catch fire as the large volume of water required to fight lithium battery fires will be making its way down to the ground floor making everything nice and damp.

Finally, I'd agree under the stairs is not a great idea either so, from a fire point of view, in my personal opinion, it would be similar to the NFCC guidance for mobility scooters: outside, inside in an FR protected room, or if no other option then in a room remote from the escape route. Not the prettiest of things to stick on the wall of your living room mind.

[jjlodgephotography]

Thank you Gary, I have 2 x 2.6kWh in the loft, when I can afford to upgrade I would consider having them elsewhere though.
1. The weight, they are on a reinforced platform with the HW tank and ASHP plant so don't want to add to that.
2. During the cold snap in winter 2022/2023 they both went into deep sleep and one wouldn't wake, had to get a technician out (3 week wait). Not such a worry now as with Cosy tariff they're keeping active and retaining some heat. But it's in the back of my mind.

So I would seriously consider siting them outside next time.