What If Napoleon Accepted The Frankfurt Proposal?

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#possiblehistory #napoleon #napoleonicwars #victoria #france #britain #congressofvienna
What if - in an alternate timeline - Napoleon had accepted the 1813 Frankfurt proposals? After being defeated in the battle of Leipzig Napoleon lost control over all lands East of the Rhine, resulting in a pause in hostilities. Metternich, the Austrian diplomatic, drafted a peacedeal to propose to Napoleon. France would retreat to their natural boundaries at the Rhine, Alps and Pyrenees. Napoleon would remain the emperor of this still formidable France, and the bloodshed would seize.

In our timeline Napoleon, being Napoleon, denied this peacedeal holding out hope for a total victory in the end. Soon though, this would prove unrealistic as the coalition forces marched on Paris. Napoleon attempted to negotiate, but as France's defeat appeared inevitable he was demanding too much. Napoleon got defeated and deposed in 1814.

But what if - in an alternate timeline - Napoleon did surrender in 1813, leaving France with their natural boundaries and a Bonaparte dynasty in charge?

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[possiblehistory]

Thank you for watching! Consider subscribing for at least one (alternate) history video every single week. To help this video and my channel grow, please take the time to leave a like a comment, it really helps out immensely, even if you just comment something simple like "hi"

[jarogniewtheconqueror]

Napoleon II admired his father a lot, and said that he preferred Josephine to have been his mother, so he would definitely carry on Napoleon's legacy

[whitehawk]

With Napoleon's death, it isn't just the medical technology that pushes his death back.
The stress added by seeing everything he created brought to ruin surely took some years off of his life.

[herobrineharry]

0:39 for all everyone talks about “invading Russia in winter”, Napoleon very clearly lost 3/4 of his forces before reaching Moscow, and 1/2 of his force before even reaching the halfway point, mostly between Vilnius and Vitebsk.

[julienpento]

The situation of Napoleon II is very tricky in this timeline. If he's too ambitious to restore french hegemony, he can lead his empire to disaster. If he's too conservative, he can trigger another french revolution (french people frenchpeopling). Also I think Great Britain will do anything to ruin his plans and isolate him diplomatically.

[Syndicalist]

you could say all of Metternich's fears were eventually realized with the Austro Prussian war, British empire, and Russian empire or Soviet union

[electricVGC]

Napoleon 2 was also a Habsburg. I think Austria and France would have been more closely aligned. I imagine the complete isolation of Spain from Italy as a consequence

[owen]

an actually thoughtful althistory vid that acknowledges uncertainty and historical contingency and thinks thru the implications of its premise… you simply love to see it

[shubhanjalshukla]

Literally all of Europe had turned against him, being pushed from all sides, all the nations were still fearful of what he could do when all the odds were stacked against him.

[dengronebaronen]

What if Sweden won the great northern war.

[Jawshuah]

this was amazing. love your in depth research. I never knew that the original peace deal made agreements about putting down revolutions.

[KonstantinValentix]

A few suggestions:
What if America didn't return to isolationism after ww1 and declared war on Germany together with France and Britain?
What if the Ente and the central powers made a "nothing or very little changes" peace after Russia made peace?
What if Friedrich III (The 100 Days) Kaiser lived to the age of ~90?
What if England won the 100 Years war?
What if France completely won the War of the Spanish Succession?
Great vid as always btw.

[cheradeninezakalwe]

So cool to see a competent alternate history chanel rise finally!

[gabilax]

Here's my own little scenario inspired by the video, hope you like it : 1825, after the death of his father, Napoléon II becomes the new emperor of a very liberal and stable France (with its natural borders). Initialy, the 14 years old teenager doesnt rule the country, a regency council rulling for him until he comes of age. With very strong liberal ideas and powerfull ministers rulling for the emperor such as Talleyrand, I could see more and more power being removed from the imperial crown, the emperor still having some power but probably not being absolutist. The regency might also cool down the tensions with the United Kingdoms, like in our reality where Talleyrand improved the relation between the French Bourbon monarchy and Britain. When Napoleon II is crowned emperor near 1830, he has to gain prestige and therefore as in our own timeline, France starts to colonize Algeria, most of Europe not paying attention to it. Napoleon II therefore gains prestige by expending a new French colonial empire in North Africa and latter in Indochina. Being the grandson of Francis II of Austria, the relations between France and the Austrians become very warm despite France being liberal and becoming progressively more democratic. During the first years of Napoleon II's reign, the industrial revolution becomes more and more important in France who quickly becomes a very developped country and the 2nd industrial power in the world behind the UK. This industrial revolution, might see the economic relationship with anglo-saxon countries becoming stronger, French loans helping the American industrial revolution and trade increasing between the two sides of the channel. The USA would probably be both a close ally of France, an historicall ally who has absolutely 0 reason to oppose them and also become quite close as in our reality to Britain due to economic and cultural reasons. In 1848 however, the Springtime of Nations happens, big nationalistic movments appearing in Germany, Austria and Italy. This event might see Germany unify quicker to try and balance the power of France near the Rhine. Austria would be destabilized by such an event and like in our reality Italy would also unify thanks to Austria being unstable. In the east, Russia would see this as an opportunity to gain influence in the Balkans and also in the middle east, this could bring France and Britain closer together, the British seing it as a danger for the Balance of power and the French seing it as a threat to their Austrian allies. As in our reality, a war similar to the Crimean war could see France and Britain working together even if this would not necesseraly happen, the British maybe still being suspicious about France. The British and the French might also work together during the wars in China if France has interests in the region with its colony in Indochina. Then come the 1870s, at this point it is hard to say if a war would break out between France and Germany, the Germans having united faster and becoming quite strong could try to invade France in order to unify the German people, however such a move would be quite dangerous since it could be seen as a threat to the Balance of power and could be a very difficult war to win France being way more industrialized, populated and stable compared to what it was in our timeline. Therefore the tensions might just continue to rise with time. In the 1890s, european powers still decide to divide Africa between themselves, in this scramble for Africa, Germany might get some more lands than in our reality with the Congo being up for grabs and France probably struggling a bit more to gain lands due to British reluctance to see France becoming too powerfull. Finally comes the 1900s, by this point Napoleon II would be dead and we cannot know who his successor would be but with France being more democratic, his rule may not have a big impact on the French Empire's policies. In this decade, the two main world powers are of course the British and the French, however, their hegemony starts to decline with Germany and Russia having gained power (maybe getting closer) and the USA becoming a very industralized nation, starting to take the number 2 spot and continuing to grow to become the first economic power. If a world war happens starting with a conflict between France and Germany over the germanic populations in the French Empire or between Russia (who may be allied to Germany) and Austria (probably still allied to the French Empire) over the Balkans, WW1 would happen. This version of WW1 could be very destructive and would be very hard to win for both sides, the front on the Rhine might see some very heavy combat but would be very hard to pierce, France and Germany being very similar in sizes. The war might be determined by Britain, Italy and the USA. If France and Austria are fighting Germany and Russia, I am sure the Italians would help Germany to gain lands in both Austria and France. The USA might still stay isolationist but they would be quite close to France diplomatically and economically and to Germany culturally (many americans being from german origins) however I wouldnt see a WW1 where the US joins Germany since they wouldnt really gain anything from the war. The last unknown is Britain, after 70 years of trade, joint policies to maintain the balance of power and diplomatic efforts from France they might join the war with the French if for exemple the German try to cross the Rhine by invading from neutral Netherlands to destabilize French forces, in this case the war would be a win for Britain, France and Austria who would take away German colonies, maybe some german states like Silesia or Bavaria who would be ceeded to Austria and create new countries from Russia like an independent Poland (Russia might see a communist revolution happen like in our reality in that case). However, the UK could also still see France as a mistake from the Napoleonic wars, as its arch nemesis, that and the relations between German and British royal families could make Britain lean towards Germany and its allies which would make a victory really easy. The peace deal would allow the Germans to annex all the germanic regions of France, all their asian and central african colonies and maybe even Austria and Bohemia which would make Germany the strongest European power and maybe even the strongest world power, Russia would take away lands from Austria and create puppet states everywhere in the Balkans and in the remnants of the fallen Hasburg monarchy, Italy would also gain a lot achieving Italian irrendentism by annexing Tyrol, Istria, Dalmatia, Corsica, Savoy, Nice and Tunisia, the British might also get some colonies but by this point they would probably be very angry about the new map of Europe being drawned. The British could also not join anyone and in that case the war may just end in a stalemate. In any case, the two future might be very different, and we could have something quite similar to WW2 with Germany, Italy and Japan being very agressive and Russia or maybe the USSR also trying to gain hegemony over Europe. Or we could have a world where Germany and Russia are the two main powers of the world and where France and Britain might be quite agressive towards this new world order.

[anabelcasas]

Speaking of the 1848 Revolutions. Would you make a video of What would happened if the 1848 Revolutions succeded?

[williamlaidlow]

I love how sober this is, you're a very capable historian!

[freewyvern]

I think Britain would likely support the French side of the Great War, Nd for a few reasons.

Reason One: Public Sympathy

With the Napoleonic Wars being quite in the past, I think the enlightened liberalism of France would be a convincing factor the the public. I could easily see relations between the British and French populations bettering over shared enlightened values like equality, abolitionism, and forms of parliamentarianism.

The public may also have sympathy for many of the independence movements, and these more harshly affect the Russian bloc than the French bloc, with the primary ones in the French bloc being beneficial to British strategical positions. Sympathy with the Poles and Hungarians would likely be pretty strong.

Reason Two: Containing Russia

France has been mostly contained. With the Treaty of Frankfurt, Britain was able to gain an, allbeit half, victory over France and contain them away from continental hegemony. The same cannot be said for Russia, who has a far easier time in expanding into places where Britain has a far more vital interest; the Middle East.

Between France and Russia, Russia simply poses a far larger threat to British interests in this region. I could also see France being far less colonial in this timeline due to having stronger Napoleon nostalgia, and thus prerfering bettering their continental position over their colonial one. This would put them even less in contention with Britain.

Reason Three: more balanced of power in a French victory

Britain would likely know that France would find it far harder to establish hegemon over large regions of Europe than Russia. Russia could easily expand their sphere into Orthodox Europe and the middle east, while France pretty much only has Italy (both establishing influence in border Germany). The French victory would therefore continue a better balance of power, and therefore be more beneficial to British interests

[MedjayofFaiyum]

9:15 - I think the more resonable thing Napoleon could do is to calm down from the constant stress of fighting. He would also be looking to win back the favour of the French population as you rightly pointed out and rebuild his Grande Armee. That depends on what limits the Allies put on him. Plus Napoleon has the favour of his Marshalls, but SOME may defect. Napoleon will think long and hard before he does anything and when he does, you cannot resist against the God of War.

[gearlordgeneration]

In your scenario Hannover would still become independent. Following this I think it is very likely that the British would try to support Prussia in order to help form a strong counterweight in central Europe that could oppose Russia but especially France. This protestant Prussia would then be their strongest ally in Europe. On top of that the Anglo-French Rivalry would in this scenario never have started to cool down but rather just escalated. There might be constant colonial wars between those nations just waiting to escalate further.
I think the British would support in an alternative 1848 the formation of a German State under Prussia. Trough French intervention it might only be possible to form a North German confederation. Eventually there would be a war between Prussia and France over the control over the rest of the German states as in our timeline in 1870 but perhaps already following the the formation of the North German confederacy. The British and Dutch would most likely side with the Germans and depending of the outcome of this war France might loose all its gains and be reduced to the same borders as in 1871.
All this will depend on:
1. Which Side does Russia side with. Their main rival might be France but it might as well be Briton at this point
2. Which side to the German states side with. Some might choose the more liberal France, some Prussia but most importantly will be the now much weaker Austria

Depending on this there might either be a super strong Mega Germany or a peak Napoleonic France Europe

[VankoGN]

1:42 The Napoleon Situation Is Truly Insane