How Orban’s “Pro-Baby” Policies are Bankrupting Hungary

In this video, we'll take a look at why Orban has introduced so many expensive family subsidies, explore how they actually work, and more importantly, evaluate how effective they’ve actually been.

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[randomguy-tgok]

"Why is [insert politician here] concerned about the demographic crisis?"

...Because they don't want the country's pension/tax systems to collapse by 2075. Next question.

[DuchessandDori]

As a Hungarian woman myself who does want to have children in the future I can tell you that these measures are not going to be effective until the public hospitals and healthcare system is on the way of collapsing (no money for essential things like soap and disinfectants, imagine giving birth in such place...), also the state of the schooling system (from what I heard there is not enough space in kindergartens, 1 kindergarten teacher for 30+ children). The level of education is also going down. So to provide a good life to your children, you would probably need to pay for private healthcare and private schools. And then I didn't even mention the overall "everyone hates everyone" atmosphere or that my children would be mixed so they would get significant hate in the country. This is why I am an expat and my Hungarian children will probably be born outside of the country.

[midnightflare]

The family allowance program was a total flop, it contributed greatly to the housing crisis in Hungary. They should have gone with social housing programs and government owned construction initiatives (but you see, that would have lowered house prices, and we can't have that).

[AliothAncalagon]

Spending double your defense budget on children is nothing to be ashamed of.
Not understanding the underlying trends though is something different.
Hungary is simply not a pro future society people would want to birth children into.

[Loki]

You left out emigration and that is the most important aspect. Hungarian women often have their children outside of Hungary, because these incentives, are nothing compared to the standards of living that a non autocracy can provide.

[drip]

He talks so much about "making Europe great again" but can't even make Hungary average

[ShikiByakko]

I love how Japan has been a study on these "benefits" for a while now, but even though it has shown that these benefits never work, they just go and say "ah, they didn't do it right, we will make it right, it will work, you will see!", just to fail again, rinse and repeat.

[andrasbekesi]

As a hungarian, I think the emigration of young hungarians as part of the problem is missing from this video. It has many causes, but one of them Orban's illiberal policies, which make the country less attractive to the more left leaning youth. So the most educated, young and wealthy populus is leaving the country, which is the biggest sin of Orban's regime in the historic scale. Many hungarian children are born abroad, which doesnt help the hungarian fertility rate, and they most propably will never be hungarians in the future.

[MaximilianJenne]

my hometown in South Germany has a high birthrate, because living there is family friendly and provides a positive future. only housing crisis is limiting it...

[KillTeamHungary]

Housing subsidies and the "baby loan" done nothing since those who sold houses raised real estate prices building in the extra cash into the base prices of said real estates...so this resulted in families going back to square one, and those couples who do not have children but would like to buy a home, now have to pay 30.000 EUR more, bcs of the Baby Loans handed out to families with kids.
Orbán is struggling, but nothing ia happening...

[thelix]

Its easy, people in Hungary finish University and move to Austria, Czechia or Poland, its been like this since Orban became nationalist for old people

[SuperDanielHUN]

I'm a hungarian who earns enough to have have children, and is currently married. We see no point getting a child here, because we have no trust in the government's institutions. Hospitals suck, and education is in the dumps. Getting a check for a few thousand euros with no strings attached does NOT help me, getting good quality education and healthcare for my child does, else I end up paying for private waaaay more than what little they helped.

Also the "160k of new children" is a completely fudged number. It takes the lowest ever birth rate (i think early 2010s), extends it till now, and assumes that as a baseline births we would have had, had the policies not been enacted. Thus, it attributes any "extra" as the result of policies. This is just headline hunting math, sure some kids were born because of the extra money, but large parts of the 160k would have been born even without the benefits as we had one of the best economic growth cycles in the 2010s. Old people love these policies, but they are not the people who have to "make" the children.

Also the video mentions that tax breaks are only effective for people that earn above a certain salary threshold. This is factually false. In Hungary we do NOT have progressive income tax brackets. Even minimum wage earners need to pay 15% income tax, and 18.5% social security tax. By getting 4 children you no longer pay the 15% income tax, but you still pay the 18.5% social security tax.

[Marconius]

*70% inflation in the past 10 years*
Conservatives: "Why aren't young people having kids?!"

[markaxworthy]

Hungarians do not want to become peoples of mixed race"? The Hungarians have been a people of mixed race since the Magyars arrived in Europe from Asia a thousand years ago. Even their language today has its roots on the far side of the Urals.

[FrankeNamensKarim]

Call me crazy, call me a pacifist, call me an ideologist, but I really think it is a good thing to spend more money for family than for defence

[Alexander-ybzc]

It's rather obvious why people aren't having children. They can't afford to and don't want to as they have lost hope for the future.

[danyuzunov]

Same happens here in Bulgaria. Us, Bulgarians, think that these "benefits" are not helping at all, but imigrants and gypsies are gladly taking em by having like 6-9 children each and letting them live in poverty!

[alfoldmapping]

As a Hungarian, first of all, I'm very glad that TLDR finally made a video about Hungary, which focuses on the reality and shows the real economic and social problems of the country. I'm also glad, that this video was not used to demonize Hungary or falsely calling us pro-Russians, Orban-lovers and nationalists, but to show some of the real life problems, which Orban make in Hungary with his policies.
About the topic, Orban is a huge fan of families with three or more children. In 2015, the government created the Family Home Creation Allowance policy (in Hungarian: CSOK), with which Hungarian families - based on how many children they have - could get a certain amount of money. This policy was ongoing until 2023, but still available in villages as of 2024. A couple with one child could get €1.500, while with two children, a couple could be granted with an amount of between €3.300 and €6.600, based on what kind of home you wanted to get.
But if you had three or more children, you could have as much as €25.000 for obtaining a home. If we make calculations with the number of children and the amount of support the government gives to the couples, these amounts are absolutely unequal. This is a clear sign, that the Hungarian government proudly supports you with their family policies, if you have at least 3 children. If you have only 1 child or 2 children, you will gain almost nothing. For my father, I'm his 4th son, but for my mother, I'm her only child - and my 3 half-brothers are already in the 30s or 40s. My mother gets barely enough support from the government (mainly just increased family allowance). She has a low-paying job, she works at least 7-8 hours in a special school, but she only earns €600, which is the net minimal wage in the county, where we live.
The family policy of Orban and the Hungarian government seems to be fascinating to see as an outsider, but in reality, this system is a lot more hierarchical and unstable than you might even think. Here, you only matter to the government, if you have at least 3 children, otherwise you will get rarely or no support at all.
Despite Orban encouraging Hungarian women to give birth to more children, this will still not solve the countless economic problems in Hungary as well as the demographic crisis. How the government handled the inflation and the rising prices in the last 1-2 years is critical and there were numerous scandals around them. No wonder, why did they lose more than 1 million supporters in the last two years. And if the economic problems won't solve in the next few years, Hungary will continue to suffer from the demographics crisis, as more young people will rather settle in Western Europe for higher living standards and better opportunities, than start to build a career here in Hungary.
Thank you very much TLDR for finally making a very detailed and realistic video about the current real economic and social problems of Hungary!

[_]

Hungary: Scandinavian taxes, Balkanian government services

[wabalaladabdab]

Orban single handedly caused at least a million Hungarians to leave the country, poverty to skyrocket, birthrates to plummet, and life in the county to be more uncertain than ever. His tax cuts, only work for the richest, and wouldn't have more kids because of that. But plummeting birthrates isn't the problem there. Not even the dictator alone. The whole society itself is the problem. Decent societies can eventually get rid of a tyrant and build a better future, but if the whole society is mentally, emotionally completely broken, beyond saving, beyond repair, then removing one tyrant wouldn't help. I'm glad that Hungary with its society isn't a great power with large population and army and nukes and stuff, but merely an isolated little mini-Russia.